Tropical Fish Keeping banner

1 - 20 of 28 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi Everyone,

I have been researching on this for a few months now, an still have a couple of unanswered questions. I would like to get cleared up before I setup my Aquarium. First of all I will tell you where I am at the moment:-

I purchased a 35L (9 Gal) BiUbe Pure, Heater pack, white pebble sculpture to cover the bubble tube, white Feng Shui pebbles to go on top of the ceramic media and 2 large easy plants. All from the reef-one store.

I know how to setup the tank, treat the water and know not to add fish for 48 hours. Once the 48 hours has past I understand that only adding 1 fish at a time is important because the tank needs to cycle, only add one fish per month until I have reached the stock limit. Which I believe to be 12 small tropical fish and 4 cleaners.

Is this right, do I need correcting on any of this?

Here are my unanswered questions:

  1. The pet shop suggested for this size tank I get 12 small fish and 4 cleaners, I would like some cherry shrimp in the tank and maybe a snail but don’t these need real plants, and also what would there be to “clean” in the BiUbe... does algae still grow?

  2. Everyone has said add one fish at a time because if you add more than one the ammonia level will be to high etc. But I also read that neon tetras like to be in groups or they get lonely. Would it be ok to add 2-4 neon tetras into the tank first or is that way to much?

  3. The fish and cleaners I would like in the tank when its fully complete are as follows:

    FISH
    4 x Neon Tetra
    4 x Purple Emperor Tetra
    2 x Black Sailfin Molly
    1 x RainbowShark
    1 x BleedingHeartTetra

    CLEANERS
    1 x Cherry Fire Shrimp
    1 x Bumble Bee Shrimp
    1 x Freshwater Clam
    1 x Zebra Snail

    I have done some research on what fish can live together peacefully and came up with them, I also wanted a good variety so the tank looks colourful etc. Am I right in thinking those listed could live together, and the amount of 12 small tropical fish and 4 cleaners are right?

  4. In my local pet store they don't have the fish I want, I spoke to some one from AquaticLifeDirect they do mail order fish, the person from the site assured me that everything is fine, all the fish arrive safe unharmed and stress free. Has anyone ever ordered online before... How did it go?

I think that is about it, any help would be greatly appreciated!

I will be taking a few pictures during setup and once the first fish are in, I will post them on here so everyone can see how I got on with it, and hopefully this could help anyone else in the future setting theirs up.

Thanks a lot.

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
92 Posts
I will help answer some of the question....

1. yes algae do grow even in the cleanest aquarium in the world, it's a matter of how you control it :)

3. the fishes you intend to keep seems fine to me. consider getting otocinclus as they are good cleaners (for certain type of algae) and suitable for small tanks.

4. I have ordered red cherry shrimp online before, but of course not from that company. And my shrimps arrived save and sound :)

I save the cycling info for the pros.....as I have to admit, I don't actually practice tank cycling, so I've very limited info to share with you on that topic.

Cheers and happy fish keeping :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,139 Posts
Before I purchased any fish, I would purchase a test kit such as API freshwater master kit. This will allow you to determine what the Ph of your water is which will ultimately dictate what fish you should keep. The test kit will also allow you to test for ammonia,nitrites,and nitrAtes so that you will know when or if these levels become a problem. In a nine gal tank that has cycled,, I would put no more than six or eight small fish such as neon tetras,pristella tetras,blood fin tetras,white cloud minnows, sparkling gouramis, or all male fancy guppies. Again this all depends on what the pH of your water is. Perhaps fish store would test it for you if you brought them a sample.
Some of the fish you list require somewhat different Water . Mollies for example need hard alkaline water to do well in the long term and the neons would do poorly in hard water. The shark simply wouldn't have enough room to cruise the bottom as they like to do and may become aggresive and territorial. Shrimps would be good fit but sometimes do poorly in new tanks and it may be best to wait a while perhaps. All of the tetras do best in groups of at least six but six fish at once would cause problems with ammonia in such a small enviornment. If you decide to cycle with fish,, I would start with no more than two of the small tetras mentioned. I would feed these two small fish a tiny amount of food (a pinch)once every other day and I would change two gal of water from the tank anytime ammonia levels rose above.25 this is where test kit comes in handy.
If you begin with thw two small fish, and feed as described a TINY amount every other day for three weeks ,,then you could add some shrimp or perhaps another two small fish while feeding the fish every other day for another three weeks. I would at this time begin weekly water changes of approx two gal from the tank using dechlorinator for the new water I added to the tank and taking care that the new water was not too cold or too hot. I would test my water anytime that fish acted strange or differently and perform water change if necessary, If you begin with no more than two small fish, and monitor your water with test kit to ensure that ammonia levels remain below .25 ,and you feed very tiny amount as described, you will have few problems. If you begin with too many fish,too large of fish,or inappropriate fish for your water (ie Ph),, you will have problems which will result in sick and or dead fish. If you know someone else who has an aquarium and they will give you some of the filter material from their tank,, you could add this material to your filter and speed up the maturing or cycling process. The material should however, remain wet when transferring it to your tank and it should be kept wet in aquarium water or dechlorinated water. some gravel from an existing aquarium approx,, one half cup. and placed in a section of nylon would also help speed the process. Simply place the stocking containing the gravel and a small rock to hold it down,, into the gravel in your tank and leave it ,as well as the filter material, in your tank for three weeks.
There is another method to cycle the tank which is much easier and doesn't require daily testing or dosing with chemicals.
You simply take a couple small ,raw,uncooked shrimp and place them in nylon with a small rock and toss it in the aquarium.leave it until NitrAtes appear on your test kit. Then remove the shrimp and toss it away(won't be much left) .then perform 50 percent water change with dechlorinator for the new water and you could add three or four small fish. wait a week, and then you could add another three and so on .I hope some of this has helped you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
If I was to use the shrimp for cycling, how long does this normally take?

I am looking at the best and easiest methods for cycling my new tank. I want to try and get it done this weekend.

Thanks

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,557 Posts
I'm adding my agreement to what 1077 has told you, completely.

On the specific fish, to be successful a community aquarium must have fish that all prefer basically the same water parameters (temperature, pH, hardness, salinity if brackish)and have behaviours that are compatible. Mixing fish with different preferences for water will cause some of them to be stressed, and that leads to health problems, more frequent disease, and sometimes fish loss because eventually they just can't struggle on. Decide what sort of community you want and make sure the fish are comparable in requirements and behaviour--and size of course, you only have 9 gallons.

Good luck.

Byron.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
I'm adding my agreement to what 1077 has told you, completely.

On the specific fish, to be successful a community aquarium must have fish that all prefer basically the same water parameters (temperature, pH, hardness, salinity if brackish)and have behaviours that are compatible. Mixing fish with different preferences for water will cause some of them to be stressed, and that leads to health problems, more frequent disease, and sometimes fish loss because eventually they just can't struggle on. Decide what sort of community you want and make sure the fish are comparable in requirements and behaviour--and size of course, you only have 9 gallons.

Good luck.

Byron.

Hi, Thanks for your reply... what do you mean by "Decide what sort of community you want"

What are the different types of community are there to choose from?

Thanks

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,832 Posts
temperature, pH, hardness, salinity if brackish)and have behaviours that are compatible.

^^ taken from byron....

pretty much what he's saying is just because you go to your LFS and the tanks say "community fish" don't assume they will all be happy in the same tank. and not all community fish will get along with other community fish....example: don't get fish that prefer water temps in the mid 70's and fish that prefer water above 80 degrees....one of the groups will not survive.

maybe just hop on google.com and see what kind of fish interest you and see if they fall into the same catergories for the aspects byron mentioned above...you'll figure it out once you start some research

Good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,139 Posts
If I was to use the shrimp for cycling, how long does this normally take?

I am looking at the best and easiest methods for cycling my new tank. I want to try and get it done this weekend.

Thanks

M
The shrimp method is no quicker than fishless method with raw ammonia. Both will take approx three weeks or longer. The only method I am aware of that would allow the tank to become safe for three or four SMALL fish over a weekend would be with the use of some filter material and or substrate from an existing tank. Do read up on (cycling a new aquarium) Patience is needed if you wanna do it right with few problems.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,557 Posts
I think I've got the opportunity here to offer some insight into cycling. I know some members in other threads have questioned the usefulness of products like "Cycle" and "Stability," but I have absolute certainly that they work.

In July, I had my (new) fishroom finally ready, so I set up my 115g tank that had been sitting empty for four years (only had the 70g and 90g running in another room). I used gravel from when it was last running, which had been washed in tap water and stored in a large garbage bucket with a lid to keep out dust. I used all new media in a new Rena XP3 filter. So no bacteria in any of this. I filled the tank, left it over night to ensure no leaks after being empty for so long, filter running, heaters working. The next day, I moved the plants from the 90g and some of the wood, and 12 Pristella maxiliaris, dosing the 115 with Kordon's conditioner. The next day I moved all 96 fish into the tank and dosed with "Stability." Repeated Stability the day following at half strenth. Nothing else was done. I tested water every day; from day one there was "0" ammonia, "0" nitrite and "5" nitrates which went up to 10 by week 2 and has remained there [now in week 4]. No fish losses.

The day after I moved the fish, I tore down the 90g, cleaned the gravel thoroughly under tap water, set the 90g up (having moved it to the new room), added brand new media to the filter, filled it, and the next day moved all the plants, wood and 89 fish from the 70g into the 90g, dosing two days with Stability. Same water test results as the 115g.

Seachem claims Stability will cycle a tank immediately. I also think the bacteria on the wood and plants worked in conjunction. And I also used Hagen Fluval biomax as the filter media (couldn't get the Eheim stuff locally) and this claims to reduce (not remove) ammonia and nitrite (didn't want any messing with nitrates because of my plants). I have some very sensitive fish--pencils, corys and hatchets, all wild caught and imported direct. Not one fatality.

Back in 1998 I had cause to tear down and thoroughly clean my 115g due to something toxic that turned out to be leeching from some of the wood and had obviously penetrated everything (filter media, gravel, plant leaves). On the advice of Lee Newman, Curator of Freshwater Fish at the Vancouver Aquarium (and now author of articles appearing in AFI), I moved all the fish (130 of them) to a spare 33g, tore the 115g apart and scrubbed everything I could with hot tap water, put it all back together, dumped in "Cycle" and the fish, all within 12 hours. Not one fish loss. There was certainly no bacteria in that new tank except from the Cycle.

I think after years of fishkeeping we gain some knowledge as to what does and doesn't work, and when faced with these situations no doubt we basically know what we are doing, and we know that we are taking some risks but unavoidably. It is still wise for new aquarists to follow the steps to guarantee success, but I am convinced that using Stability or a comparable product will benefit. Seachem says Stability contains bacteria that colonize the surfaces; some have previously suggested that bacteria can't live in the bottles of Stability. Seachem, in resonse to an enquiry by a friend of mine who owns two large stores in this area, stated that it is live bacteria but the explanation on how this is done was somewhat mystifying. It obviously works.

Just some observations I thought I'd pass along to help. Attached is a photo of the 90g (top) and 115g (lower photo) taken just before sending this post. There are now 113 fish in the 115g, and 89 in the 90g.

Byron.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Thanks for all this advice everyone, its been a lot of help!

This Stability sounds interesting, where could I read more on that? Or buy some.

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,557 Posts
Thanks for all this advice everyone, its been a lot of help!

This Stability sounds interesting, where could I read more on that? Or buy some.

M
It's manufactured by Seachem, they have a large range of products, good water conditioner (Prime), good plant fertilizers (Floruish line) and Stability is relatively new. Any fish store that carries Seachem products probably has Stability. You can read info on their products on their website at Seachem Laboratories. Sea the Difference
Click on "PRoducts", then "Conditioners", then "Tank Cycling/Bacteria".

The thing I really appreciate about Seachem (aside from the clear fact that so far everything I've used has really worked to do what it claims) is their technical detail on products; their breakdown of the macro- and micro-nutrients in Flourish for instance is very good to know.

Byron.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Hi Byron,

Thanks for this info, I have been reading up on Seachem Stability. It sounds almost to good to be true, some people are saying it doesn't work and there is no quick fix apart from Bio spira which is only available in the US.

I would like to try this Stability,

My tank is brand new, do you think if I add tap water to my tank use the Dechlorinator leave it for 24 hours then add 1 cap full of Stability on the first day and then half a cap for the next 7 days the water will be ok to add fish?

Thanks again

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,557 Posts
Hi Byron,

Thanks for this info, I have been reading up on Seachem Stability. It sounds almost to good to be true, some people are saying it doesn't work and there is no quick fix apart from Bio spira which is only available in the US.

I would like to try this Stability,

My tank is brand new, do you think if I add tap water to my tank use the Dechlorinator leave it for 24 hours then add 1 cap full of Stability on the first day and then half a cap for the next 7 days the water will be ok to add fish?

Thanks again

M
I know of the Bio spira, but we can't get it in Canada because being bacteria that is frozen they won't let it across the border [learned this from the owner of two large stores in this area]. From our conversation, I would assume it is also good.

Fill the tank with water, get the filter and heater running, and leave for 24 hours just to ensure everything works and no leaks. Add the conditioner and Stability just before you add the first fish. Both work instantly. Use Stability according to directions, I think its 1 capful per 10 gallons the first day, then half that (1 capful per 20g) every day for a week. With a new tank and no other source of bacteria I would follow this exactly; I cut back after day 2 because I also had bacteria-laden wood and plants. Bacteria need food, which is ammonia for nitrosomonas bacteria and nitrite for nitrospira bacteria; with no fish in the tank, the bacteria can't live long (and obviously won't multiply), since fish are the source of the ammonia that starts the nitrification cycle. Again with a brand new tank, I would not overload the fish. It is simply my view that using Stability allows you to add a few fish from day one and get the cycle going immediately, without stressing or losing fish.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
Thank you very much for all your advice, I will let you know when my cycle is complete and I have added my first fish.

M
 
1 - 20 of 28 Posts
Top