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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am extremely frustrated and discouraged, I have just purchased my first fresh water tank, admittedly I wasn't as informed as I should have been but since realizing my lack of education I have really stepped up my game. (Small rant about the lack of information given to me by my questions I asked at the pet store.)

All that said I feel like I am disappointing my fish, I have been really good at cleaning my tank every week, I do a 25% water change every Sunday and I vacuum my rocks and everything! I have also been checking my water and my ammonia levels and had been very good and then this week my ammonia has been on the rise and NOW so have my Nitrites and Nitrates. :( NOW 2 possibly 3 of my fish have ich, I have been administering treatment I haven't found much that can give me a defined step-by-step on what else I can do. (another small rant about the lack of concise inform)

I really enjoy having my fish and I have been trying really hard to take care of them well and I thought I had been until they got ich and now one of my tetras has NTD and I don't know what to do everything I read tells me to "remove him" and or euthanize him. I don't see the point in letting him suffer if there is no cure but I can't find anything about how to euthanize a fish humanly.

Please help this is really discouraging for me...
 

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A lot of issues can occur quickly during the first 2 months of a new aquarium. It is truly sad that some fish stores do not provide better advice prior to selling stuff. I have been through all that you describe.

Are you handling the ammonia/nitrite issues OK? This requires regular partial water changes (every day or alternate days if using a conditioner like Prime or Ultimate which detoxify ammonia and nitrite for 24-48 hours) until both read zero consecutively.

Ich occurs when fish are stressed. Best treatment is raising the temp to 85F and using CopperSafe. I have had great success even with delicate wild-caught fish using this method.

As for euthanizing, many will suggest various methods but mine is the quickest and easiest. Net out the fish, place it in a paper towel folded over several times, and give it a hard thump. This kills it instantly, causing no more trauma that netting any fish does.

Byron.
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Byron!

No I had purchased some Ammonia lock but it wasn't doing anything! I will get right on the water changes! With the Ich should I do a normal 25% change or a more drastic 50% change? I have also removed my filter and I am not suppose to put a new one back in Sundays.

I was also wondering I have a foam thing on the end of my filter should I remove that and get a new one as well? I have it on there because when I first got my fish one of them got pulled into the filter and I couldn't find him and then I found him in there and he was alive but he died the next day I assumed from the stress.

Anyways... about the euthanizing I maybe should have mentioned that the idea of physically killing I am pretty sure would be rather scaring for me and I would feel terrible is there anything I can have less of a hand in and doesn't result in him being squished or banged up against something violently?:shock:
 

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No I had purchased some Ammonia lock but it wasn't doing anything! I will get right on the water changes! With the Ich should I do a normal 25% change or a more drastic 50% change? I have also removed my filter and I am not suppose to put a new one back in Sundays.

I was also wondering I have a foam thing on the end of my filter should I remove that and get a new one as well? I have it on there because when I first got my fish one of them got pulled into the filter and I couldn't find him and then I found him in there and he was alive but he died the next day I assumed from the stress.

Anyways... about the euthanizing I maybe should have mentioned that the idea of physically killing I am pretty sure would be rather scaring for me and I would feel terrible is there anything I can have less of a hand in and doesn't result in him being squished or banged up against something violently?:shock:
You have to kill it somehow. You don't see anything in the paper towel, and it is quick.

Filter is fine.

Water changes daily or alaternate days with those conditioners until ammonia and nitrite are zero.

The ich complicates matters, but the ammonia and nitrite will kill the fish so they have to be dealt with. Raise the temp to 85F.
 
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If you are opposed to Byron's method you may be more comfortable with placing the fish in a small container of tank water and putting it in the freezer.
 

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On the euthanasia front, get some clove oil (it's sold as dental pain relief medication) and vodka. The clove oil puts the fish to sleep, and then you add vodka to the water, which will cause the fish to pass away. It's not too expensive, and it was very peaceful. Still sad, but at least it wasn't brutal and he didn't have to suffer anymore. Here's a link with the exact measurements and ingredients:
What Is the Most Humane Way to Euthanize a Fish? - mobile wiseGEEK
 

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For the squeamish, I might place the fish in disposable container of water and freeze it.
I normally do as Byron has suggested, or Sever the head with sharp knife.
Some claim that freezing the fish is cruel but to each their own.
Other's use clove oil I believe but i have never used that method so can't comment/expound upon it.
 

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I can vouch for the clove oil and vodka method. Clove oil has long been used as an anesthetic in fisheries. You can often find it behind the counter at most drug stores. Just make sure you mix the clove oil with water before you add it to the bowl/container with the fish. As the old saying goes, oil and water don't mix well.

I'm terribly sorry you've had to come to this point. I have had to use this method a few times and has not been easy any of those time. I don't care what anyone says, fish are pets and it hurts to lose them just like it would a cat or guinea pig.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thank you so much for this suggestion! This was definitely a lot easier for me and I didn't get that terrible feeling in my stomach! Thank you this is so helpful and he went very quietly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Update

So I did my water change and I will continue to do a 25% water change until my ammonia decreases. It has stopped increasing which is a good sign. My levels were:

pH: 7.6 (which is on the high side I know but I also read that adding chemicals to fix it can be very iffy and that its better to let it level itself, and my fish are more on the high scale for pH so I think this is okay, if not I am totally open to suggestions)

Ammonia 0.50ppm

Nitrite 0.0 ppm (YAY! this is down from 0.25 so this is encouraging)

Nitrate 0.0ppm (YAY also down from 5.0, although I noticed when I went to rinse it that it smelt like rotten eggs, I hadn't noticed that before is this normal?)

Temp is not at 86 for the ich

one of my black tetras that had an ich spot on him is gone! Sadly though my two neons that have ich their fins are not looking so good at all.

Is there anything more I could be doing? I feel like things are maybe starting to look up but I want to be sure I am doing everything I can!
 

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It seems some misunderstanding is happening here.

Did I understand that you removed your filter? Your ammonia and nitrites were increasing, This indicates that your tank was beginning to cycle. This requires a filter with media (foam, sponge, etc) to feed and house the nitrifying bacteria colony.

Your latest readings indicate that you're going backwards. Please read up on cycling http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/...inners-guide-freshwater-aquarium-cycle-38617/

Also review and read all the threads you can in the archives here with the word cycle or cycling in the title. This will give you some background and understanding of the nitrogen cycle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thank you Hallyx this is very helpful, but I think regardless of knowing this information I would have removed the filter, I was instructed to because of the ich, from my understanding if I left the carbon filter in there I was just wasting my ich medicine because the filter would stop it from going back through the tank. I treated them on Wednesday the 6th with their first dose of ich treatment then I had to wait 48hours and then on Friday the 8th (yesterday) I administered their 2nd dose, I am suppose to wait another 48 hours before replacing the filter one of my fish that did have ich no longer has ich so the medication seems to be working. I do not want to disregard your advise but I am getting mixed information which is frustrating and confusing.
 

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Removing the carbon and replacing it with common filter sponge or even gravel would have been better for your cycle than removing the entire filter. That's what I would do. Forget about carbon for a simple freshwater setup.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Air Stone?

Removing the carbon and replacing it with common filter sponge or even gravel would have been better for your cycle than removing the entire filter. That's what I would do. Forget about carbon for a simple freshwater setup.
I bought two small sponge filters today and my normal carbon filter, the sponges fit behind the carbon so that what I can also if need be replace one sponge at a time, that makes sense right?

Also I bought an air stone to help maintain the water temperature the fish really seem to like it they swim through the bubbles alot! :p I am just wondering if this is something I run constantly or is it like my light where I should give them a break from it?

I put the sponge filters in today but I gave them another round of ich treatment today so I haven't put the carbon filter back in yet till I am sure the ich is gone! Thank you all for your help!
 

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Hey Tigg ,
I was wondering if anyone had mentioned the use of aquarium salt to you ? I use it as a staple for medicating my tanks , before I ever use any type of medication I will incorperate the aquarium salt ( API ) brand . It works great for alot of bacterial problems if you can catch it early in stages and its easier on the fish than most medications and its safer as far as overdose is concerned and its easy to overdose with medicine when your first starting in the hobby . Not to say that its okay to just pour it in either lol but a half a teaspoon to much wont be catastrophic . I use it in particularly for fin rot and ick myself , along with 30 - 40 % bi daily water changes .
I am very sory to hear about the lose of fish but dont let it disourage you alot / most fish you get from chain store or big name pet stores (petsmart , pet co ) an so on are so weak geneticaly that they dont make it alot of the time and have very very low ammunity to disease thats not your fault .
You will do better to get your fish from a good well known breeder online on this site for example than from the stores .
That said this is a wonderfull hobby that will bring you years of pleasure and satisfaction just keep your head above water ;-) .
Tip:- You might add some live plants to your tank they will help ALOT with water quality , oxygenation , filtration and food for alot of fish . It doesnt matter what kind they will all benifit your tanks health , a few in particular that are good starters are java fern ( any type ) and moss (any type ) the moss is a great detox for your tank for the nitrites and ammonias .;-)
Good luck and God bless
p.s , if you know the stuff i told ya already im sory for the repeat i just wanted to help .
 

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Ich takes a while to cure. Keep treating for at least 3 or 4 days after you see the last of the spots.

As for carbon, you don't need it in your filter for any reason other than to help remove meds from the tank. When you're done treating, put the carbon filter cartridge back in for a week or so. Then you can just use regular sponge or filter medium after that.

If you have the cartridges that have charcoal in the middle of floss, you can always cut away part of the floss and remove the charcoal before replacing the filter.

Air stones are a good idea to have in your tank to increase oxygenation while treating or when raising the temperature in the tank. You can leave it in there but take it out if you decide to go with live plants.

Good luck and keep us posted.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Hey Charlie! This was really helpful thank you!! A few follow up questions though:

If I have already treated with ich medication would it be helpful still to add the salt? How much (I have a 10gallon tank)

You recommended
aquarium salt ( API ) brand, would sea salt work? Or is it very specific kind of salt?

I seen about buying fish online, How does that work with shipping, that sounds very expensive??

I had considered the live plants before but I went to go buy some and the guy at the fish store told me I had to wait till my tank had been established for 6 months is this true?

Thank you for your advice! I really appreciate the help!!

 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks Romad! Just curious as to why I would want to take out the air stone if I add plants? Is it just the over abundance of oxygen would make it difficult for the plants to live?
 

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If I have already treated with ich medication would it be helpful still to add the salt? How much (I have a 10gallon tank)
No. Never, never combine two (or more) medications/treatments. They can interact, making things worse, or one may negate the other, or cause various chemical reactions. End result is highly stressed fish.

When treating a disease, only use one method. Do a major water change or several major water changes before commencing any other "treatment" if the first is still present.

You recommended aquarium salt ( API ) brand, would sea salt work? Or is it very specific kind of salt?
"Salt" means different things. Common salt, sodium chloride, is not the same as marine salt. Aquarium salt is common salt. Some fish are highly stressed by common salt. Soft water fish are. There are better treatments in most cases.

I had considered the live plants before but I went to go buy some and the guy at the fish store told me I had to wait till my tank had been established for 6 months is this true?
No. More bad advice, or strange advice, from a fish store.

Plants can go into a tank on day 1. If they do, they will help avoid any "cycle." Plants aid in establishing a fish tank.

Byron.
 
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Hey all!

Bit of an update... Still have ich I am feeling kinda dishearten, I have been administering the ick medication with still no results still 2 neons with ich and one black tetra that keeps showing signs of ich on and off.

I was at a local pet store today and the store owner suggested "blacking- out" the tank. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on this, they swore by it, but for obvious reasons I am a little unsure of taking pet store persons advice. So just wondering about this.

I am seriously considering trying the salt method because I really don't think the ich medicine is working, is it possible that I have a resistant form of the disease?
 
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