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Crazie Queenie 07-27-2011 06:56 PM

Over stocking?
 
Been worried that ive over stocked my tank and i cant get my head round the way your meant to tell how many fish to a tank mainly cause i suck rather badly at maths anyway can someone help me out with whether this is an over stocked tank.

90L (UK Liters)

9 Mollies - 3 Dalmatian 1M/2F - 6 Black 1M/5F

9 Guppys all Males

2 Panda Corys - Would love more

2 Common Plecos - I have only just realized tonight they are "common" plecos as they were not named that in the store :evil: i love them but know they can grow pretty huge so if over stocked or would be no room for other fish i think these would be the first to go sadly :(

oh and 1 tiny shrimp that never comes out from under his bit of driftwood for fear of being molly food.

Thanks anyone who helps! :-)

ladayen 07-27-2011 07:11 PM

Yes you should try and get rid of the plecos. They will grow up to 18" and would be best in a 75g tank(think thats like 300L?) You can add some more cories to get your group of 6 and that should fill you up.

Now on a side note.. guppies and mollies will breed together. This can lead to a very sudden increase in your tank population. Between the 2 you have 7 females and 11 males. It is recommended you have 2 females or even 3 for every male because males will chase the females to the point of exhaustion, and even death in an attempt to be "amourous". Maybe try to trade off some of your males for females.

Crazie Queenie 07-27-2011 07:32 PM

Turns out 90L is just under 24 US gallons.

Hmm i was trying to keep the molly numbers at a decent female to male ratio i didn't realise the male guppys would be involved in that to even though they seem completely uninterested in the mollies. My male Dalmatian molly is totally the king of the tank i see him raising his fin at the other mollies quite alot and will sometimes chase the 2 female dalmatian ones but he doesn't seem to bother the black ones as much if ever actually.... I had been thinking of taking 4 of the male guppys back so maybe i will do that and take the plecos back as well while telling them to label their fish correctly...

I do know about the sudden increase in tank population problem as one of my mollies already dropped some fry on a very unprepared me so ive been setting up well getting ready to set up a fry tank but thats all on another post on here :)

Thanks for the help :-D

CQ

LasColinasCichlids 07-28-2011 06:40 PM

To answer your question on overstocking... With 90L being about 24 gallons, with those fish, I definitely say you are VERY overstocked!

In that size tank, the 9 male guppies are probably all that tank should have in it, and maybe the shrimp :)

Mollies get rather large, and should be in a 29g+ sized tank, but thats only for a couple...for 9 of them, I think they should be in a much larger tank, say a 50g+ sized tank.

The common plecos are for sure a major issue in that sized tank. Not just for the pure size they will obtain, but for their massive bioload that can and will wreck havoc on your tank's water parameters causing ammonia spikes and such.

Ladayen is correct about the reproduction with mollies and guppies, as well as the ratio of males to females. As well as the cories needing a larger group. The bare minimum should be 3-4 cories, 5-6+ being ideal. In your tank size though, if you keep just the guppies, shrimp, and add to your cories group an get it to like 4 cories, your tank should be more appropriately stocked.

Hope this helps you out some in answering your question.

Crazie Queenie 08-01-2011 08:03 AM

Thanks fore the info. I did always intend on getting more corys as i know they prefer larger groups but for one they are pretty expensive here and 2 they only had 2 at the lfs. The plecos and 4 of the guppies are going to a new home some point this week at which point i'll be getting some more corys. As for my shrimp they are all in my fry tank now and seem a hell of a lot happier in their with my 3 fry which im happy about cause it means i actually get to watch them instead of never seeing them. The dalmatian mollies are a decent size but all the black ones are pretty small so I'm assuming they are still quite young. Since i want to try sort the ratio of M/F out with the guppies and mollies would you suggest getting some female guppies since they are smaller than the mollies? Or just leave it the way it will be once the 4 guppies and 2 plecos go? Since they all seem to get along fine anyway. Cause the mollies are all staying.

Thanks

CQ

LasColinasCichlids 08-01-2011 06:11 PM

When it comes to mixing sexes of mollies and guppies, it should always be either all males or all females, unless trying to breed. If trying to crossbreed mollies and guppies (their fry is infertile and is often thought to have a shorter lifespan), the female needs to be the molly and the male the guppy... female guppies can die while trying to give birth to such large molly babies. Their mixed babies are called, Muppies.

Glad the plecos are finding new homes.
Are your mollies standard mollies, or the hybrid balloon mollies? Balloons would be okay in that tank size with that many of them, as being hybrids they have deformed body structure which doesnt allow them to grow properly and ends up with a much shortened life span. If they are traditional mollies, they can grow over 3 inches long! I had a lovely black male molly named "Velvet" in my 29g tank, he was almost 4 inches long, biggest fish in the tank. (I've never kept more than 3 mollies in a 29g tank at one time for lack of space that they need.) Mollies have a pretty big bioload, especially when larger, they also can have aggression issues that are usually handled with large tanks. The ideal sex ratio for mollies if not keeping only male or only female is 2-3 females for every male.
If they are small, that means you have time to get them the right size tank. As they grow in size and behavior you will begin to see why a larger tank or fewer in a smaller tank is recommended and needed for this fish species. Its a common misconception because they are a livebearer and just so common everywhere, but these mollies do need a fairly large tank.

Crazie Queenie 08-01-2011 07:42 PM

I Don't intend on trying to cross breed them at all so im hoping they wont.... I wont get female guppies then as that would just be cruel knowing they may end up pregnant to a molly and more than likely end up dead :o(

I have 3 Dalmatian 1M/2F was 3 females but one died after giving birth a few days after i got them and 6 black 1M/5F so as you can see by that i was trying to keep the ratio ok but was unaware that the guppies would effect that ratio. I refuse to get balloon Mollies as i think its just cruel to breed something that is so malformed it will never have a chance to actually develop properly.

Hmmm i dunno what to do really cause my mollies are like my babies lol i don't wanna give them up :o(

The black ones are still quite small the dalmatian ones are much bigger than them in particular the male, more commonly known to me and my mates as "fatty" lol, who is the total king of the tank. The dalmatians were the first fish i got for the tank so i guess to him he was there first so its his tank. Problem is i can't get a bigger tank right now as i rent a bedroom from friends and a bigger tank ain't gonna happen until i get a lot of other stuff sorted out and my own place but that wont be till at least sometime next year..... Do you think they would be ok in this one till then since the black ones are still kinda small? Or do they tend to grow pretty fast? The biggest black molly is like half the size, if even that, of the male dalmatian one and the male dalmatian is about 2 inches long including his tail and as you may have guessed by his name tends to be a tad on the plump side lol. When he sticks his fin up he is probably at least an inch and a bit from his belly to the tip of his fin.

Thanks

CQ

P.S i just noticed your info says your in Irving Texas that is pretty much right next to where i was living for the first part of last year lol small world!

DKRST 08-01-2011 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ladayen (Post 753772)

Now on a side note.. guppies and mollies will breed together. This can lead to a very sudden increase in your tank population. Between the 2 you have 7 females and 11 males. It is recommended you have 2 females or even 3 for every male because males will chase the females to the point of exhaustion, and even death in an attempt to be "amourous". Maybe try to trade off some of your males for females.

Sorry for the correction, but guppies and mollies are completely different species and will not interbreed. That's quickly becoming the equivalent of an aquarium "urban legend". That won't necessarily keep the males guppies from harassing non-guppy females, but you won't get any viable offspring!

There have been literally just a few reports of hybrid guppy/mollies, but all the reasonably documented events (key term here is well-documented, not some youtube video) indicated that when it happens, and it is super rare, the offspring are not viable. Don't worry about the interbreeding.

If all your guppies are males, don't worry about getting female guppies, unless the male guppies are harassing the female mollies.

LasColinasCichlids 08-01-2011 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazie Queenie (Post 761088)
I Don't intend on trying to cross breed them at all so im hoping they wont.... I wont get female guppies then as that would just be cruel knowing they may end up pregnant to a molly and more than likely end up dead :o(

I have 3 Dalmatian 1M/2F was 3 females but one died after giving birth a few days after i got them and 6 black 1M/5F so as you can see by that i was trying to keep the ratio ok but was unaware that the guppies would effect that ratio. I refuse to get balloon Mollies as i think its just cruel to breed something that is so malformed it will never have a chance to actually develop properly.

Hmmm i dunno what to do really cause my mollies are like my babies lol i don't wanna give them up :o(

The black ones are still quite small the dalmatian ones are much bigger than them in particular the male, more commonly known to me and my mates as "fatty" lol, who is the total king of the tank. The dalmatians were the first fish i got for the tank so i guess to him he was there first so its his tank. Problem is i can't get a bigger tank right now as i rent a bedroom from friends and a bigger tank ain't gonna happen until i get a lot of other stuff sorted out and my own place but that wont be till at least sometime next year..... Do you think they would be ok in this one till then since the black ones are still kinda small? Or do they tend to grow pretty fast? The biggest black molly is like half the size, if even that, of the male dalmatian one and the male dalmatian is about 2 inches long including his tail and as you may have guessed by his name tends to be a tad on the plump side lol. When he sticks his fin up he is probably at least an inch and a bit from his belly to the tip of his fin.

Thanks

CQ

P.S i just noticed your info says your in Irving Texas that is pretty much right next to where i was living for the first part of last year lol small world!

Be glad you arent living near here this summer!!! It is HOT!!! We have been at over 100F for like two months now, with a day or two inbetween where it was only 98F, but today was day 30 straight of being in triple digits. At 9pm tonight, it was still 101F!!! Too Hot!!! I need a summer home in Alaska!!! lol

As for the mollies... their growth rate can be expedited by certain water parameters, not sure which ones, as all fish are different. I know for example, with guppies warmer temps make them grow faster, but that cuts their life span. While cooler water (but still in their needed range), allows them to grow slower and live longer...same with mystery snails. Also over feeding can cause faster growth, as well as more bio in the tank from excessive poop, causing ammonia spikes in the tank. And you of course want to maintain nitrates that are under 50ppm, preferably 20ppm or under. Nitrates, while still being researched are thought to be the least threatening thing in aquarium water chemistry to fish, but studies have proven that high nitrates can cause stunted growth, which in turn caused organ failure, deformities, and early death.

I would expect a molly to reach full growth size in a year or less time.

I dont want to say they would be fine for a year all together in that tank size, but I dont want to say that it is the worst thing in the world if all other needs are met.

If there are no other options, lots of water changes and continual upkeep with water parameters to their liking will be needed, as well as proper food intake. (Mollies are omnivores, so no-meat food should also be provided for optimum health. Tetra makes a crisp that has both meat and veggies in it, perfect for this fish. The crisps are a bit large, so I crunch them in my fingers before feeding, or I did when I had omnivore fish like gourami...still do often since I have omnivore cherry barb.)

If at all possible maybe a second tank of siimilar size set up and cycled so you can split the group up in half so they can have ample swimming room and higher changes of good water quality??? Overcrowding has lots of ill effects, including poor water quality, which the best way to combat that is with water changes.

Have you ever visited AqAdvisor - Intelligent Freshwater Tropical Fish Aquarium Stocking Calculator and Aquarium Tank/Filter Advisor It's a tool to assist is overstocking based on tank size, filtration, and species of fish. You should try it out, input your info for your tank, and see what it says to give you an idea of what you are looking at as far as stocking goes. And for comparison, put in your full stock with the plecos and all and see, and also try re-arranging the stock there to see what you would be able to have to have your stock under 120% by their tool. It is interesting to see. And I say 120% because there is room for error with any tool. In my signature you can see what I have stocked...in my 29g tank it reads crowded, but aqadvisor has my stock in the low 90%.

DKRST 08-01-2011 09:41 PM

Concur - aqadvisor is really useful!


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