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Iron addition for heavy planted tank

28K views 38 replies 5 participants last post by  redchigh 
#1 ·
Hi all,
I have tested the aquarium for iron 1 day after I dosed Seachem Flourish which should have some iron but resulted around 0.1mg/l which is low right?

Test kit is advising to add more iron. Should I get Seachem Iron? Or something else? Should i dose iron weekly and seperate from the Seachem Flourish?
 
#2 ·
how big is the tank? you must know that the plants take in iron right.thats why the iron reading is low.a lot of people here use it and the plants are fine without adding other stuff in it. do you have shrimps in the tank?
 
#4 ·
when theres shrimps in the tank iron and other heavy metals will kill off your stock. they are sensitive to it. so far adding the flourish once every 2 weeks into my tank which has fert soil that is over a month old isn't hurting my shrimps and they are multiplying which is a good sign. and overdose of fert will make the bodies slowly die off starting from the tail area. if you want to keep only plants and fish the added iron will be good for the plants just don't over do it.cause the water gets heavy metals from the water and flourish too
 
#7 · (Edited)
What's your normal PH without CO2?

When you say stock... You mean fish stock, not plants right?

In your case, (since it is high-tech), you may want to dose additional nutrients...
Here is something that might be useful-
Fertiliser Calculator


Seachem's reccomendation is below. (I would leave out the excel and ph adjusters.)



Did you know the can of worms you were opening when you decided high tech? :p

For more information, you're just going to have to google.
 
#8 ·
worms that eat money right?

hehe yeah but that is what i call aquarium addictive :)

about the phosphorus, nitrogen i can get this with fish waste.

Still waiting for tank to cycle before i can get loads of more fish but soon this will be fully stocked.
 
#11 ·
Redchigh is correct, once you start increasing one nutrient or light, all the others need increasing as well. As I frequently write, it has to be balanced.

I have a low-tech natural system, and the CO2, phosphorus and nitrogen come from the fish and waste. But if I doubled the light, it would do no good; or added CO2, useless. Unless I increased all the other nutrients. Which only makes sense; if the plants are utilizing these nutrients completely now, where will they come from if I increase the light? It doesn't matter what type of system you want, there must be a balance and the plants will not photosynthesize beyond the limiting factor.

I don't follow the cycling comment; if there are live plants, just put in some fish. Plants use the ammonia/ammonium as their preferred source of nitrogen so there will be no "cycle" to speak of. Bacteria will still appear, but it will be minimal by comparison to non-plant tanks.

Be careful with that iron thing. Iron is a heavy metal, and all heavy metals are highly toxic to all life, be it fish, plants, humans, micro-organisms, whatever. Iron is only a micro-nutrient for plants, not a macro; they don't need all that much. And years ago I got on the iron kick too, and nearly killed my plants because I didn't understand that iron was no more essential than the 16 other nutrients. We live and learn.
 
#12 ·
Hi Byron,

thanks for your explanation. So in your opinion i need to dose an extra Seachem flourish? Right now i only dose the normal weekly. I shall not include iron. As for fish i need to add extra then.

Right now the tank has a lot of brown algae. I read that this is when the tank is new.

Also regarding PH - KH - CO2

So my water change will have PH of 7, KH of 3. PH controller is set for 6.8 PH. Should I lower the PH from controller to 6.6 to have some more CO2?

Thanks
 
#13 · (Edited)
Let me see if I can re-word what was said.

Most of us here, use the low-tech method, with flourish comprehensive. Comprehensive works well in the low tech (and low light/CO2 from fishes only) because it's enough of all the nutrients to balance with the nutrients that come out of the fish and fish food. If you raise light and CO2, you will definately need to dose flourish more often, but flourish alone will probably not be enough. (Since it has less of the nutrients that come directly from the fish.)

As for which nutrients come from fish and fish food, and you may be lacking with only flourish comprehensive:

Macronutrients:
Nitrogen
Phosphorus
Potassium

Micro nutrients:
Iron (Through flourish Iron)
Magnesium (Through Flourish Trace)

Don't ask me how much specifically, but I know for a fact that all of these are in fish food and fish waste. Might take a while for a deficiency to pop up, but it probably will eventually.

Flourish web site at http://www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/Flourish.html said:
Flourish™ is designed to be used in conjunction with other macro and micro-nutrient supplements.
As for the CO2.. (I did a bit of research back when I thought high tech was the only way to have a tank full of plants) Aim for a ph reduction of .2 if your water ph is close to 7.
More importantly is the ppm- You want between 15-20 ppm of CO2. Err on the side of caution, since the ideal amount is really close to the deadly level- 25-30ppm. There are lots of charts, but your best bet would be to find someone with your same water params and match their bubbles per second (with a bubble counter.)

This is why I went with low tech. :p
 
#15 ·
Yes. Have you looked at the many photos in my Aquarium Log? I have had tanks like these for 20 years based on the methods I write about. And understand, this is only one of several methods to have planted tanks. But it is the easiest, the least expensive, and it works.

Plant growth will vary according to the method. More light and more nutrients (in blanace;-)) will (or should) mean faster growth. But in low-tech the plants will still grow, and be healthy, and do the job of water filtration. Some plants do not do so well in low tech; this is mentioned in the profiles where relevant. But the vast majority of aquarium plants will remain alive in any tank--provided the light and nutrients they need are available.
 
#16 ·
can you give me a link where i can find these?

Also returning on my system so in your idea i should add more ferts?

Also Right now i have some algae issues. So lots of brown algae (guess because it is a new tank right?)
i also have like spots of brown algae on the top layer of the water. If I scoop it with net it seems to be brownish/greenish algae. What could it be? How can I eleminate it?

Also on driftwood i have some strings of algae like sewing treads. I can remove it manually but is there something wrong so that i can arrange and not have any more?

Thanks
 
#17 ·
can you give me a link where i can find these?
If you mean my photos, they are under the tab "My Aquariums" just below my user name on the left.

Also returning on my system so in your idea i should add more ferts?
If you are running CO2 and have higher light, I think you will need more. The plants will tell you, and perhaps moreso algae will proliferate.

Also Right now i have some algae issues. So lots of brown algae (guess because it is a new tank right?)
i also have like spots of brown algae on the top layer of the water. If I scoop it with net it seems to be brownish/greenish algae. What could it be? How can I eleminate it?
Diatoms (brown algae) is common in new tanks,usually during the first 3 months. Remove it from plant leaves (it comes off with your fingers, some "algae" fish eat it but I don't recommend buying fish just for this). The floating "scum" is a protein scum, it can be in a sheet or spots here and there. Not an issue, I syphone it out during water changes in tanks where it occurs. it seems more prevalent in some tanks and never in others. Has to do with organics and nutrients I expect.

Also on driftwood i have some strings of algae like sewing treads. I can remove it manually but is there something wrong so that i can arrange and not have any more?
Brush algae and hair algae will appear on wood and rock; Ileve it as it is natural. When it starts attacking plant leaves, I monitor it closely; too much light and it will proliferate. Algae is natural, it will always be present, but we aim to keep it in check. On plant leaves it works to prevent the exchange of gasses which is detrimental to the plant.
 
#19 ·
Ok so best is to add a dosage of extra seachem flourish weekly so that i ferts twice a week.

I want the link of methods to do a low tech fully planted please.

thanks
The article series "A Basic Approach to the Natural Planted Aquarium" is at the head of this section of the forum, there are 4 parts due to text limitations in each post. They lead from one to the other.
 
#20 · (Edited)
They're right at the top of the aquarium forum. Byron took the time to write some immensely helpful guides that nearly all of us have read- some of us multiple times.


"Sticky: A Basic Approach to the Natural Planted Aquarium--Part One "
(then read the rest of them.)

Read more: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/aquarium-plants/#ixzz11i2iQG00

Could also look into soil substrates as well for future tanks. (my signature)

And as for tanks full of plants... Well, I do. My soil substrate one I'm working on now will be my masterpiece. (The others were practice. ;) )

EDIT- Aw, Byron! You beat me by seconds!
 
#22 ·
For many people it is.

My only complaint about it was the higher price (I'm cheap) and the fact that it's MUCH more work (I'm cheap and lazy).

Of course, you won't have the bright red Alternantheras and flourescent purple Cabomba Furcatas, but your plants will grow, and you there's still a wide variety of colors. (admittedly, mostly green.)

As for the algae, It's definately due to too much light. It's just kind of a guessing game on whether you're lacking CO2 or ferts... Might be both.
 
#24 ·
Okay, high tech planted tanks can be a bit of a pain to sort out, but they can be quite enjoyable. Your tank apears to be about 118 gallons w/ 215 watts of good light giving you 1.8wpg. So given the size of the tank and that light level you got a nice tank with some great potential. First off the algae is normal. Secondly you are going to HAVE to dose that tank with ferts. Its not an option. And given the size and light level you are going to need some major ferts. You will go broke using seachem and other brand things. Thats why the EI(estimative Index) was created. I highly recommend reading up on this, though it will probably sound like a bunch of gibberish at first. I honestly can't see any other way to effectively fertilizing your tank. Your weekly or biweekly fertilizing with a single product is not going to cut it. The way you have your tank setup right now its going to need ferts daily till it becomes stable and you get the hang of what ferts it needs. You don't just blindly add ferts, which will cause more problems then it will fix.

What is your nitrate level and CO2 level? Also do you have a drop checker(your playing russian rulet if you don't)? At this point don't worry about iron. I think your lighting level is fine, but like redchigh said its a nutrient or CO2 issue.
 
#25 ·
nitrate is 12.5mg/l
i do not know co2 but ph controller is set to 6.6

If I go with Seachem products what type of ferts do I need to add?

About EI that I did not like is because you need to do wc weekly whilst I am going to do the wc bi-weekly.

what is a drop checker?
 
#27 ·
Hi Byron, I read your article a nice article.

now i have a 60 litre tank with 15 W t8 for 10 hours per day. As plants i have some crypts, marsilea hirsuta (never grows after 6 months it seems to die), Sagittaria Subulata, moss and anubias (very ugly :( ) I use seachem flourish per week and do 10 litres wc per week.

Crypts seems to melt a lot. I have a pair of kribs and 6 pygmy corydoras. As for water parameter 16GH, 8PH, 3KH. Tap water from where i make WC is the same.

What could be the problem? Water temp is around 27-28degrees Celsius.
 
#28 ·
So you have a 15 gallon tank with 15 watts of light over it..

Any sort of enriched substrate (or fertiliser tabs)? That's probably the problem with the marsilea.. Plus marsilea species prefer cooler water than most tropical fish.

What kind of light are you using? We reccomend cheap 6500k flourescents (often called daylight). What kind of bulb is it? T5? T8?
 
#30 ·
Hi Byron, I read your article a nice article.

now i have a 60 litre tank with 15 W t8 for 10 hours per day. As plants i have some crypts, marsilea hirsuta (never grows after 6 months it seems to die), Sagittaria Subulata, moss and Anubias (very ugly :( ) I use seachem flourish per week and do 10 litres wc per week.

Crypts seems to melt a lot. I have a pair of kribs and 6 pygmy corydoras. As for water parameter 16GH, 8PH, 3KH. Tap water from where i make WC is the same.

What could be the problem? Water temp is around 27-28degrees Celsius.
substrate is enriched. Seachem Flourite Black Sand. No fertiliser tab ( Do not think that i need ). Temp is 27 degrees celclius.

Light i am using T8 Day-Lite from Juwel.JUWEL Aquarium Homepage It is on for 10 hour per day. I do not know the kelvin ratings thogh.
Last thing first, on their website you can click on "Lighting" and then "Day" and it says the tube is 9000K. That's pretty high in the blue with little red. Could be one problem with crypts melting.

Another crypts problem may be your high pH. This depends upon the species; some crypts do not do well in hard, basic water, some will if it is slightly (low 7's pH). Check the species in our profiles, this is mentioned.

Crypts melting means something has changed in either water parameters, nutrients or light. Or they have been disturbed (roots). All crypts do not like changes in any of these areas, and will often melt in response to any one of them. A few species are more resilient, this also is noted in the profiles.

Your temperature is quite high--is there a reason? Corydoras pygmaeus would be happier at a lower temp (profile notes 22-26C as preferred range). A degree or two may seem trivial to us, but to the fish in the water which controls their internal temp it is significant. And 1 Celsius degree equals about 2 F degrees in this range. As redchigh noted, this may also be the issue with the marsilea.

Fish and plants "work harder" at higher temperatures, and oxygen is in less supply (more important for fish), so maintaining fish and plants within the lower end of their preferred ranges is usually better.
 
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