Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources

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-   -   "Natural" vs ???? (http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/beginner-freshwater-aquarium/natural-vs-42426/)

TexasTanker 05-05-2010 03:01 PM

"Natural" vs ????
 
I was admonished recently for not having a "Natural tank." I can't say I know or understand what qualifies as natural or the adverse of that. I look at the photos of other people's tanks and notice they have plants and fish and very "natural" looking set ups. Does having colored gravel and ornamentation (that's not native to the fish) with live plants, constitute not natural?

Will the less than natural bottom stress my hardy little platy out? I was kind of under the impression that as long as I kept it well planted, had hidey holes, a varied diet, and balanced water, that they would be fine. Is there some addendum to that, that I missed?

redchigh 05-05-2010 03:27 PM

Well I'm not sure how many studies have been done oh if the fish 'recognise' that something like, I dunno, an air-powered floating scuba diver decoration in your tank isn't natural...

but as for substrates, improper decorations, and things, it's definately true that it does NOT mimic their natural habitat. Whether a fish that's been captive bred for generations will know or notice, may be up for question.

I've heard that brightly colored gravel can stress a fish because it's too reflective. Fish are programmed like everything else on earth- the light should be coming from above. If the substrate is neon or something it might have a 'glow' to it that could be quite unsettling.

If you like your tank, and the fish are healthy, that's what's important. Many people like to see their fish in a tank that mimics the fishes' natural habitat. But if you want purple gravel (preferably not reflective or neon) then that's up to you.

I think aquarists have a bit of leeway with what they can do that won't bother the fish. Multicolored gravel and some fake corals in a freshwater tank might look odd, but I don't neccesarily think it will bother the fish TOO much. Having mechanical 'toys' like divers and skulls and things... might be crossing the line a bit.

A natural tank probably would help fish enter breeding mood (would you want to breed if there was a creepy scuba diver moving around your house or everything you saw looked like an acid trip??) but whether it will kill the fish (if done moderately), I doubt it.

TexasTanker 05-05-2010 03:46 PM

We are creepy scuba diver and neon gravel free. I was gonna submerge an (fake) armadillo along with some other stuff in addition to some weighted driftwood. I'm pretty sure my avatar now has a picture of the tank in it's starter stage. There will be a lot of foliage and "natural" features, but nothing animated or overtly bright colored. Much of the white area will be planted and the new lights I'm getting will render the red as red, versus the pink that the existing lights create.

redchigh 05-05-2010 04:53 PM

Red might actually be fitting, since some fish are from sandy-bottom creeks/rivers, and the sandy clay is often reddish...
What kind of lights are they? I hope you did your research and they're good for plants. (6500k is a somewhat bluish light)

The armadillo... how big is it? Are you positive it's safe for your aquarium?
I wonder if armadillos eat fish... might have some kind of predator-prey response in the fishes head...but thats extremely unlikely.

TexasTanker 05-05-2010 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redchigh (Post 377920)
Red might actually be fitting, since some fish are from sandy-bottom creeks/rivers, and the sandy clay is often reddish...
What kind of lights are they? I hope you did your research and they're good for plants. (6500k is a somewhat bluish light).

I'm going with T5 lights, with a daymax and a color max. The ballast that I'm waiting for also has LED's on it. i believe they are some shade of blue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by redchigh (Post 377920)
The armadillo... how big is it? Are you positive it's safe for your aquarium?
I wonder if armadillos eat fish... might have some kind of predator-prey response in the fishes head...but thats extremely unlikely.

We're talking a three inch figurine of an armadillo in a cowboy boot. They are not especially picky eaters, but I don't think I've ever seen one fishing before. I also highly doubt my captive bred platy will recognize it as much more than some funny shaped thing with eyes. It is stamped resin, so no paint chips. I sprayed it this afternoon with polyeurithane (sp). That should be fully cured and compatable by next week. I also just got a call from our local aquarium supply, the drift wood I wanted will be in on Friday.

I'm so excited that this is coming together.

zof 05-05-2010 06:39 PM

I do have to say the gravel in your tank brings a smile to my face, how long did it take you to get it in there like that?

Byron 05-05-2010 07:33 PM

I won't enter the debate on whether bubbling mermaids and such do or don't affect the fish exposed to them because I am not a biologist and don't know. But from considerable research and personal experience I do know that what is important is to ensure that the fish in an aquarium have what their instincts require. It need not be "natural" so long as it is there; for example, a knifefish will readily use as a "burrow" a length of PVC pipe, something it (hopefully) would never encounter in its natural habitat. But the important point is that the item must be provided for the fish's well-being. I'll begin with a citation from one of Peter Hiscock's aquarium design books since he says it so well.
In unsuitable surroundings, fish become stressed and unhealthy. Although water conditions in the aquarium may be ideal, a fish that has developed to survive in one particular environment will still suffer if it is placed in a completely different one. For instance, a fish accustomed to a densely planted environment with plenty of hiding spots will feel highly vulnerable in a relatively bare tank. The fish does not "know" that it is free from predators and, without the safety of hiding spots, will be continually stressed. Eventually, it succumbs to disease and may even die.
I frequently mention the light intensity and colour of the substrate; these two things, perhaps more than anything else save the water itself, are extremely important to fish. Most (though not all) of the fish we house in aquaria are what I call forest fish; they occur in streams, ponds, flooded forest and sometimes swamps in densely forested areas of the tropics. Little if any direct sunlight penetrates the water, or if it does, it is diffused light coming in between the shadows of leaves in the towering trees. The substrate is frequently mud or leaf littered and therefore dark. Some streams are sandy, but the sand is not the almost white sand one frequently sees in tanks but the dull buff coloured sand, and the diffused light and frequently-tannin coloured water means that very little if any light will be reflected off the sand. Some streams are rocky and gravel-based. But in all these cases, the substrate is naturally dark and non-reflective of light, and the fish expect it.

Place these type of fish over a pale or white substrate, and the fish lose their colour. That is not accidental, it is a deliberate defense strategy that nature has programmed into the fish. Fish do this by expanding or contracting their dark chromatophores in an attempt to be less conspicuous. Hyphessobrycon bentosi is one of some 30 species of Hyphessobrycon that form what Weitzman and Palmer termed the rosy-tetra clade; all species exhibit a dark humeral/shoulder patch. When H. bentosi, the commonly-called Roberts Tetra, are maintained over a pale substrate, this shoulder patch disappears completely; but over a dark substrate comparable to their habitat, it is quite visible.

Although it was not intentional, I had first-hand evidence of this only a year ago. I had acquired a group of seven Hyphessobrycon metae, a dark purple-bodied tetra from Peru. I placed them in my 70g aquarium that was relatively heavily-planted, with a natural buff-coloured gravel substrate. During their eight months in this environment, they rarely came out from behind plants and wood. Last July I reset my 90g as it is in the photos, as a flooded Amazon forest aquascape; I used darker gravel for the substrate. All the fish, wood and plants from the 70g were simply moved into the 90g. From the very first day after, the shoal of H. metae were and still are continually out in the open. The reason: the dark substrate gives them a feeling of security because it is natural. Simultaneously, their colouration also darkened from what it had always been in the former tank. They have obviously spawned, as I currently have three 1/2 inch fry swimming alongside the adult fish.

Place a group of angelfish in a bare tank and they pale; place them in a tank providing vertical plants, wood branches and floating plants, and they sparkle and behave as nature intended. The branches and plants can be plastic or real wood and live plants, the fish don't seem to care; they only need the security provided by the objects.

Redchigh's comment on the armadillo is well taken. If the fish perceive this object as a predator, they will be stressed. Dr. David Sands in the 1990's did extensive work on the genus Corydoras, and observed their defense mechanisms using artificial "predators" that clearly evoked a sense of fear in the corys even thought the "predator" did not move.

Byron.

TexasTanker 05-05-2010 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zof (Post 378010)
I do have to say the gravel in your tank brings a smile to my face, how long did it take you to get it in there like that?

I cheated. After much trial and error, I developed a thin plexiglass frame to separate the colors. After more error than trial, I did it again, putting slits and holes throughout it, to allow for a more natural flow through the gravel. Then I had to very carefully round off all the edges. Calculating three inches of gravel in four segregated areas was almost as fun as adding it in.... a cup full at a time. Don't get me started on filling it with my 7 and 8 year old "helping."

Byron, thank you for your input I'll def. consider it when it comes to lighting.


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