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Question about aquarium setup

3K views 20 replies 6 participants last post by  Byron 
#1 ·
Hey forum

So I have had an 18 gal Eclipse aquarium for a couple years now, but I didn't completely thoroughly research it as I should have (I was too young/excited to have been able to get one that I didn't even think about the different facets of information I needed) and now I am struggling to attain as much knowledge as I can because so far, I think I have been doing everything wrong (or in the least efficient matter). I'm going to try and give as complete information as I can.

Filter: It's worked into the top of the tank. It has one inlet and goes over a carbon pad, and through a "biowheel" and flows back into the tank.

Lighting: 1 regular fluorescent bulb and a "Coral Life : Nutrigrow" for my plants.

Substrate: Just gravel. It's not fine gravel, but it doesn't look as big as some of the others I've seen.

Fish: 1xRosybarb,1xCongo Tetra, 1xAlbino Barb, 1xBetta 1xCory, 2xsmall snails.

Plants: Elodea (Pondweed, I think it is) and....I don't know what the other is. I have it in my picture, on the left. The other I think is a type of sword, but it lost all its leaves and I'm hoping it "comes back." You can't see it in my picture.

Other: 2xshells, 2xrocks, 1xwood piece thingy (< It has some white/red dots on it. Should I be concerned?)

Maintaince: Once a week I do a ~25% water change; Check pH.

I recently came into contact with a more experienced hobbyist and he suggested that I take the pH as well. As of today, the pH is still =/>7.6 (which I know is bad now, I'm treating it still.) It was because of this more experienced person that I realized I probably don't know what I'm doing, and I am eager to do things the right way.

I appreciate your help.:)
 
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#2 ·
Alright i can point out a few problems here:
1. Everythin but the betta there are schooling fish that should be kept in groups of a least six if not more and you keeping them all alone is really bad for them and they will not live to there expectancy.
2. DO NOT mess with pH just let it be fish can adapt to it but if you try to alter it with chemicals it will not be stable and the swings are bad for your fish. A stable pH is better than the exact pH a fish needs.
3. Get rid of the carbon filter media its really bad for your plants, only use them after you medicate a tank to remove the chemicals.

thats all i got

Phil :)
 
#3 ·
Well, if the carbon hasn't been changed ever or even recently, it's probably not removing anything anymore so I don't think you need to worry about it eating up nutrients for your plants. That, plus it's probably pretty heavily colonized with beneficial bacteria at this point, so it's probably better just to leave it be.

Can you get us an accurate pH reading? Hardness would be good to know, too. I ask for the "accurate" pH reading because you suggested it might be greater than 7.6 (some "standard" range pH tests max out at 7.6 so it could be a great deal higher). The shells in your tank are likely increasing your hardness and pH, so getting these numbers from your tap water would be good to know, too.

I agree with what was said about your fish. All of them except for the betta are schooling fish that should be in groups of at least six. Is your "albino barb" an albino tiger barb? I hate to break it to you, but the barbs and tetra are all varieties that get pretty big and need more space than your tank can provide. The albino, if it is a tiger barb, will also get quite nippy and might harass and nip at your betta. The betta is definitely fine in a tank that size and so are the cories. As long as your gravel is relatively smooth, a group of six or eight cories, the betta and a decent sized school of tetras (plus the snails you've got) would make for a really nice tank. In short, I think you should try to return the congo tetra and barbs, get more cories and round out your stocking with fish that can live comfortably in your tank (there are tons of schooling fish that fit the bill: all sorts of tetras, some of the smaller barbs, rasboras, etc.).

Can you get a close-up of the spots on your driftwood? That would help figure out what those spots are. Nice looking piece of driftwood, btw. Also, did you buy your gravel like that from the store, or did you mix different kinds to get that effect? Looks pretty cool.
 
#4 ·
+1 on everything said so far....I would return the congo if you can as well as the lone barbs and pick up anywhere from 5-7 more corries....trying to keep the same species if you can...

I agree on leaving the pad in there, that carbon is probably long-gone as far as removing nutrients, so let it be...

Another plus on not messing with the pH, overtime trying to alter your pH will cost a lot of money and more importantly will add stress to your fish

The other thing I noticed was your HOB with plants....unless you can keep your tank completely filled the HOB will create surface disruption and release oxygen which you plants need....something to consider.

I would pick up a group of smaller shoaling fish that you like....keeping your natural pH in mind as well as your water hardness....
 
#5 ·
Some nice fish you could consider for schooling are;

Tetras: Neon tetras, Black neon tetra(Dont get confused its not the same species as the neon tetra), Lemon tetras, Flame tetras, Glowlight tetras, Rummy nose tetras

Other: White cloud mountain minnow, Harlequin rasbora(or any other of the smaller species), Zebra Danios, Pearl danios

Hope this helps a little,

Phil :)
 
#6 ·
Thank you all for your advice =]

@iamthebatman I didn't buy the gravel like that, I combined black gravel and the natural light one. I also think it came out rather well.

I'm really disappointed with the Congo Tetra and Albino Barb. I thought they were really nice, and wanted to keep them. But if it won't work, it won't work. I wouldn't mind more cories, I'm growing fond of the one I have, haha. What about the rosybarb? Is that going to be okay?

My tap water is also =/>7.6. I don't know how to get a more accurate reading, it only goes up to "7.6." :-? Is this okay for my fish/plants? They'll live?

Also, I was actually expecting more criticism about the plants. Are they find where they are; they only have gravel...? What's a HOB?

Here is the best pics I could get with my crappy photo-taking...uh, how do I put them directly in this post? I only figured out how to attach them...

what about sunset mollies (I think that's what they're called)or gouramis? What's "hardness" and how do I measure it? I took the shells and driftwood out, the shells because of what was said and the wood because it had those weird bumps on it.

I wanted to get more plants, and I was wondering if any of these would work:
Elatrine traiandra
Ledwigia repens
Anubias spp.
Cryptocoryne spp.
Echinodorus spp.
Vallisneria spiralis
(I'm probably going to get this for sure)
Aponogeton elongatus
Lemma minor
Java Fern
Java Moss (< I'd actually really like to get this)

I appreciate you sharing your knowledge. :-D
 

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#7 ·
Oops...I think I missed a few points:

@philipboucharddavies: thanks for the suggestions! I was going to ask for some, but then you posted x]

Carbon pad: I haven't changed it recently, and my hobbyist friend advised I add another carbon pad on top (it was at about the same time so none of them have been changed recently) so I can only change one while keeping up a bacteria colony. Is the second unecessary then?

pH: Yes iamthebatman, as you said my pH indicator only goes up to 7.6 - and thanks for the compliments on the gravel and driftwood, I'm glad to see something looks right. =P

Albino Barb: Yes it's an albino tiger barb - but the barb, tetra, and betta all seem to be taking turns chasing one another...

last question (at least for now): What's "shoaling" fish?

sorry if my questions are novice. I try to learn everything I can to make the most of my aquarium.
 
#8 ·
Please someone correct me if I'm wrong here but I think -

Shoaling is a schooling fish that like to school with its own kind i.e. alphabet tetras will only school with alphabet tetras, and not with other schooling fish like numerical tetras.


I have 2 congo tetras and have found that other congos are hard to find, so I asked why not just buy another group of tetras for them to hang with, and the LFS guy told me that congos only like congos, so buying cardinals wouldn't make the congos happier as they wouldn't school together even though they are both "tetras"


Does that make sense or have I made things clear as mud?
 
#9 ·
I have no idea what that stuff is on your driftwood. If I had to guess I'd say it's likely just some sort of fungus. You can probably just take the wood out and clean it with a brush but you could also boil it just to be sure.

PaperClipGirl's right about the shoaling. Basically, some fish are designated as "shoaling" or "schooling" fish which means that they require the safety of a group in order to thrive. Without a group, the fish are constantly stressed out and stressed fish are much more prone to disease than happy fish. The effects are more pronounced in some species than others but generally you really only want to keep schooling fish if you've got room for an appropriate sized school.

Here's the breakdown, basically: Congo tetras can get to four inches long and as you've observed, can be very active swimmers. A group of six of them really needs at least 36" inches of swimming room, with 48" being preferable. Same goes for rosy barbs but these get even larger, at around 5" for adults. Tiger barbs stay smaller than these (maxing out at about 2.5-3") but are very active swimmers. Tigers are also notorious for their "wolf pack" behavior; the fish will establish a pecking order and have sort of a chain of command for aggression. They need a large school (some say 18+ fish are needed) to prevent one particular fish from being the "target" and getting killed, so a big tank is needed for them. That, plus they'll nip at other species, especially those with long, flowing fins like your betta.

Hardness is basically a measure of the dissolved mineral content in your water. Usually a high pH is associated with hard water but it's not always the case. If you can, I'd get your tank and tap water tested for pH and hardness by a LFS (local fish store). Since your test kit maxes out at a pH of 7.6 it could be much higher than this in reality, so knowing what it actually is is important.

The other fish you mentioned: mollies are usually pretty well-mannered community fish so they might work, but sometimes you get misbehaved ones so be prepared to take fish back if you get one that annoys your other fish. I wouldn't get a gourami as they're closely related to your betta and anabantids in general are very territorial and prone to fighting with one another. I think you should wait for your water chemistry results to come in before choosing fish, though, as there are species you should definitely avoid pending your water parameters.

As for the plants, the one on the right looks like anacharis and the one on the left does look like some type of sword. Anacharis is a pretty easy plant so that should be fine as-is. You might want to buy some root tabs to stick under the sword's roots as swords are heavy root feeders. You might want to PM Byron and bring his attention to this thread so he can ID the plants for you and give advice on the other species you mentioned (I do know that anubias, java fern, java moss and some of the crypts are fairly easy plants to grow).

HOB = "hang on back" filter. They're also referred to as "power filters." These are a common type of filter that sucks water up through an intake tube, passes it through filter pads and then pours it back out into the tank in a waterfall. The filter built into the hood of your eclipse is basically an HOB filter even though it doesn't technically hang on the back.
 
#10 ·
Just joining this thread at shootingstar26's request. Previous responders have covered the fish issues, so I can get to the plants. I agree with the prior suggestions that before you decide on fish, find out the water parameters (pH, hardness). Most fish stores will test your tap water. We need to know the exact numbers for pH, GH (general hardness) and KH (carbonate hardness) if they will test these.

The plant on the left may be Echinodorus angustifolius, a species of sword plant from southern Brazil. Would it be possible for you to take a photo of the entire plant, down to the gravel? The rock in front is obscuring the lower portion.

Gravel is fine for planted tanks, no issue there. You will need some liquid fertilizer though, to provide all the mineral nutrients plants need. I recommend any one of these three:
Seachem's Flourish Comprehensive Supplement for the Planted Aquarium
Kent Freshwater Plant
Nutrafin's Plant-Gro
Whichever you decide to buy, follow the directions on the label; once a week will probably be sufficient. Make sure you get exactly the names above, as all three manufacturers make several plant products and these I've named are the best general fertilizers for your type of aquarium.

I'd like to hold off on the plant list until we know your water parameters and a better idea of possible fish. Plants are generally quite adaptable, though some are more fussy over water hardness, but they should complement the fish. And as has been pointed out, the original mix of fish has some non-compatible species, and some are better in basic water or acidic water than others.

Post the water test numbers when you have them, and we'll continue.

Byron.
 
#11 ·
Thank you Byron!

I will go to my "LFS" (I'm learning already!) and get the water tested, and I'll post them either here or on a new thread, and we can go from there.

Right now, I was given FlorinGro for my plants...it says it's a concentrated nitrogen source. Do I need this?

here's a marginally better picture...

OH and the plant that lost all its leaves grew a shoot today. I hope it grows. :)
 

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#13 ·
First on the FlorinGro, from what I can find on several sites including the manufacturer's this is strictly a source of nitrogen. I would not recommend it. Nitrogen is necessary for plant growth, but aquatic plants prefer nitrogen as ammonium which they obtain from ammonia produced by the fish and biological processes in the aquarium. There should never be a need to add nitrogen. Of more importance, is the other nutrients that do need to be added, the 15 minerals in particular. I recommend one of the three fertilizers I suggested previously; of the three, Seachem's is probably the best, then the Kent.

As for the plant, in my opinion this is not a species of Echinodorus (Amazon sword family). I think it is a Cryptocoryne from SE Asia, possibly C. albida but I'm not certain; my knowledge with this genus is more limited, but I believe Angel079 (Natalie) knows several of them and she may see this and chime in, or you could send her a PM to have a look at this thread.

Byron.
 
#15 ·
That helps. First on the plants, most of those in your list are possible. You expressed a liking for Java Moss, that would do well on the wood, once attached it will spread over the wood. And Vallisneria (corkscrew) you like, that will work fine in your water. Only get a couple, as once established it will send out runners with daughter plants and fill in. I would also suggest one sword, they make nice "centrepiece" plants, placed not in the centre but to one side, maybe next to the wood. It will grow large, I suspect it is the commonly available Echinodorus bleherae. Anubias and Java Fern must be attached to wood or rock, not planted in the gravel. And they do well in shade, esp Anubias, and are slow growing. As this is your first planted tank [hope I remembered that correctly] I would forget the Aponogeton and Cryptocoryne; Apon usually need a dormant period and lose their leaves for a few months; crypts are fussy plants, beautiful but very temperamental. Ludwigia repens would be a nice stem plant.

To the fish: livebearers would suit your water perfectly. If you like tetras and want to go that route, there are some that should manage. Have a look at the Fish Profiles section of this forum, along the top the second name from the left; here's a direct link:
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/profiles/
There are quite a number of the more commonly available tetras now included, and water parameters are suggested for each species. Some will do well above pH 7, some not at all, and others probably. There are photos of each species too. We can discuss more when you have some ideas.

Byron.
 
#16 ·
Awesome, thanks for the suggestions Byron =]

You remembered correctly, this is my first planted tank. I like plants, and would like to see more of them in, but I should probably wait until I get the "feel" of taking care of the ones I have now before I add more.

About the fish: Someone brought to my attention to this: http://www.aqadvisor.com/AqAdvisor.php

But...according to this I can have like; six, maybe seven, fish and then my tank is overstocked. I was hoping to put in >10/<15 fish, especially if I need a minimum of 4 cories and some shoaling fish have to be in groups of 4+. Does anyone know how I could diversify my aquarium without sacrificing the comfort of the animals?

I was thinking of adding shrimp...if that affects my situation in any way. Do they eat the fish? or just snap?
 
#17 ·
Awesome, thanks for the suggestions Byron =]

You remembered correctly, this is my first planted tank. I like plants, and would like to see more of them in, but I should probably wait until I get the "feel" of taking care of the ones I have now before I add more.

About the fish: Someone brought to my attention to this: http://www.aqadvisor.com/AqAdvisor.php

But...according to this I can have like; six, maybe seven, fish and then my tank is overstocked. I was hoping to put in >10/<15 fish, especially if I need a minimum of 4 cories and some shoaling fish have to be in groups of 4+. Does anyone know how I could diversify my aquarium without sacrificing the comfort of the animals?

I was thinking of adding shrimp...if that affects my situation in any way. Do they eat the fish? or just snap?
I don't mean this to be disrespectful of others who use these formula, but I do not. I use common sense from my 20 years experience. You learn (we all do) about fish and what will and won't work based upon the preferred water parameters (which all fish in a tank must share) which includes pH, hardness and temp, behaviours of the species, how they interact, their maximum size, their activity level, the environmental issues (plants, wood, caves if needed, territories)...and how you maintain the tank.

You have an 18g tank; a first consideration is space, and I'm thinking not of volume but of length and height. Shoaling fish that like to swim (danios, some tetras) would find a longer tank and shallower much more "normal" and thus be healthier. Corys don't particularly care, because they like to just poke around all over the substrate, but having bits of wood and plants makes them more at ease because it gives them more surface for poking around (they browse plant leaves, wood) plus it breaks up the substrate and is more "interesting" as we would call it. Similarly, a small gourami or betta would feel at home in a tank with less length or not, because they are sedate fish that spend time among floating plants browsing for food, breathing at the surface, and so on. Some pencilfish also suit this taller tank, same reason; the Nannostomus eques (diptail pencilfish) act just the same, browsing plant roots and twigs, not swimming around. Cardinals do well in such setups, but rummynose don't because they swim more. I think you get the drift--and I'm not meaning to suggest all these mentioned go together in your tank, it is just for illustrative purposes I mention particular species.

So, once you know the type of fish you want, bearing in mind they need to suit the physical environment, water parameters, and such, the number will depend upon their needs (size, activity, behaviour).

Byron.
 
#18 ·
Awesome. Thanks a lot Byron! You've been a big help. =]

I'll probably stick to some platys/mollies, get a couple more sterbai cories and maybe a small shrimp, and leave it at that. I'll also probably get the java fern/moss, may the anubais, and the ledwig repens, and that'll be all for plants (although I really want a densely planted tank).

One more thing. I have a spinning bio-filter thing, and my hobbyist friend said they're more or less useles; I have more bacteria on my carbon pad probably. Can I take the spinning filter out and replace it with a sponge?
 
#19 ·
Awesome. Thanks a lot Byron! You've been a big help. =]

I'll probably stick to some platys/mollies, get a couple more sterbai cories and maybe a small shrimp, and leave it at that. I'll also probably get the java fern/moss, may the anubais, and the ledwig repens, and that'll be all for plants (although I really want a densely planted tank).

One more thing. I have a spinning bio-filter thing, and my hobbyist friend said they're more or less useles; I have more bacteria on my carbon pad probably. Can I take the spinning filter out and replace it with a sponge?
Yes, absolutely. Put the sponge filter in and leave both for a few days, to allow bacteria to colonize the sponge so when the other filter is then removed it won't cause a mini-cycle issue.

What are your water parameters (pH and hardness if you know them)? Might suggest some other plants when you answer.
 
#20 ·
Well, when I test my water it reads 7.6 (that's the lowest, the next highest is 7.2) when I tested it at PetCo the other day, the assistant got 7.5. When I asked for water hardness he only told me that my water was "hard."
Just in case, I have 1 x fluorescent bulb and 1 x CoralLife Nutrigrow specifically for my plants.

by the way, that fish you have as your avatar is absolutely gorgeous. Is it some sort of puffer?
 
#21 ·
Well, when I test my water it reads 7.6 (that's the lowest, the next highest is 7.2) when I tested it at PetCo the other day, the assistant got 7.5. When I asked for water hardness he only told me that my water was "hard."
Just in case, I have 1 x fluorescent bulb and 1 x CoralLife Nutrigrow specifically for my plants.

by the way, that fish you have as your avatar is absolutely gorgeous. Is it some sort of puffer?
The avatar is Centromochlus perugiae, sometimes seen under the former genus name of Tatia perugiae, commonly named a spotted woodcat. It is a small catfish from South America, quite peaceful. It has a very large mouth opening for so small a fish, it reminds me of a vacuum the way it sucks in bloodworms. It would do the same with small fish or fry if they were present. And it hunts at night. This is a true nocturnal fish, spending the daylight hidden in tunnels in wood, coming out at night and foraging for food very fast. I have my three trained to come out for bloodworms around 5 pm, and if I go in front of the tank around that time, they will be waiting at the entrance of their respective tunnel (they reside in the standing piece of wood at the far left of my 115g under the filter return because they like a current), their eyes and noses peering out. As soon as the tank glass slides back, all three rush out and swim very fast around the wood. Other than this, I never see them.

Livebearers will do well in your water. And while many plants will adapt fairly easily, there are some that really thrive in harder water. Vallisneria is one. The small "corkscrew" species is quite beautiful, and well suited to livebearers. Mollies are great with Vall, as they browse algae from the leaves. Years ago I had a nice aquascape with black mollies and all Vallisneria, it grew like weeds; sends out runners with little plants very fast once it is established in the tank. Some of the larger species would suit your taller tank nicely, have a look at the photos of Angel079's vallisneria, they were in another thread yesterday, here it is: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/aquarium-plants/johnnys-plant-build-35054/page16/#post338579
Java Fern will do fine too. Anubias I suspect will, though it is an acidic water plant, but quite hardy. Ludwigia should be good.

Byron.
 
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