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stephanieleah 02-06-2010 08:19 PM

dwarf baby tears and dwarf hair grass
Does anyone have this whose lighting is in the 1 wpg range?


Suggestion for ground cover for a 1 wpg tank?

Angel079 02-06-2010 08:22 PM

I have both plants. While using florescent tubes over the tanks I have them in; which equal just about 0.5 wpg

Thou I wanna 'warn' this wpg is totally outdated really; it does not take into account if you have T8 or T5 or HQI or CFLs or whatever; non that is taken into account with the wpg measurement and so I'd strongly suggest to not use that type measurement (which I think was created sometime back in 1980 time frame)

Mean Harri 02-06-2010 08:33 PM

+ 1 what Angel said. The wpg rule was applied to the T 12 bulbs. The T 12 are being phased out and replaced with T8, T5, compact fluroescent. These replacements give off more light than T12. A T8 is 32 watt and gives off more light than a T12. T5 more than T8 and T12. Then there is high output T5 that is brighter yet. The way of wpg is gone. What is more important is LUX and CRI. The higher the CRI the more lumen output there is. I think I said that right. If I'm wrong it will be corrected. Maybe it's more Lux per lumen with a higher CRI. I forget now. I've read so much about that stuff I forget most of it.
Generally T8 over the tank will be lower to moderate lighting. The wattage goes down in bulb size but it still equates out. I'll be doing two 32 watt T8 over my 55g. Wpg that is 1.16 wpg. Not much but, that 1.16 wpg of T8 is brighter than 80 watts of T12.

I prolly just screwed this all up. Didn't I?

The dwarf baby tears will grow in the lower to moderate lighting. At least from what I remember on sweet aquatics site. Generally hair grasses require and do best with high light. I believe the dwarf hair on their site can do moderate light.

stephanieleah 02-06-2010 08:39 PM

oookay. so I have a 32 watt double compact flourescent lamp now and I have a fixture that houses two T5s or T8s. Those will be equivalent to roughly the same wattage. But I want to look for the LUX instead? Is there a formula to use? Most of my plants are medium light plants so I don't want to put in a high light plant that's just going to die. Are they pretty resilient to "regular" lighting?

Mean Harri 02-06-2010 08:52 PM

Have you read this part in a thread elsewhere?

Beyond choosing lighting that is optimal for photosynthesis, as above, you should choose lighting with the color temperature that best suits the aesthetic goals of your tank. So, don't obsess about color temperature beyond how you want your tank to look. From a color temperature standpoint, blue-colored light will enhance blues in your fish. Green-colored light will make the tank look bright to humans and enhance the green color of your plants. Red-colored light will enhance the reds in your fish, and any red plants.

Lux is lumens/square meter, so they are similar. They are both defined in terms that are meaningful to human perception of light – not plants. They stress the amount of energy in the green band to which humans are most sensitive – not plants.

Artificial light sources are usually evaluated based on their lumen output. Lumen is a measure of flux, or how much light energy a light source emits (per unit time). The lumen measure does not include all the energy the source emits, but just the energy with wavelengths capable of affecting the human eye. Thus the lumen measure is defined in such a way as to be weighted by the (bright-adapted) human eye spectral sensitivity.

Lumen ratings are usually available, but when you use them you have to keep in mind what they mean. Lamp A can have a higher lumen rating than lamp B and appear brighter to you, while lamp B provides more useful light for plants. Compare the lumen ratings for cool white and GroLux bulbs of the same wattage and you will see what I mean. A 40-watt cool white bulb is rated at 3050 lumen; a 40-watt GroLux bulb (not the wide spectrum) is way lower at 1200 lumens. The big difference is because GroLux lamps provide very little green light and cool whites provide a lot of green light. I have found it best to provide a mix of lighting to a planted tank. The GroLux bulb is perhaps the best plant bulb available but it has very little green light so the visual effects of your tank will look dim and purplish. Yet if you add some other lighting such as a Philips 6500K the effect is more pleasing to the eye and still beneficial to the plants. I find that the GroLux along with a GroLux wide spectrum (89 Color Rendering Index) has a great effect for use as dawn/dusk lighting. (A Sylvania rep. told me it was best to use both together.)

Kelvin rating and lumens does not equate for plants. The Kelvin scale is more of how your tank will look to you/us and is totally subjective. It is true that the lower Kelvin ratings like 3000K will have more red light and a 10,000K will have more blue light. Lumens are meaningless for plants, as green plants do not utilize green light for photosynthesis. A higher lumen rating at the same wattage often means greener light. Lumen is a rating weighted entirely towards human perception. It has little to do with the value of a light for either growing or viewing plants.

Angel079 02-06-2010 08:53 PM

I donno where I seen the pic of your tank today (the small one 10g with the Anubia) where I said that tank's looking REAL bright compared to mine (on the pic anyway); so really if both these plants thrive in my dim tanks neither would I qualify them as needing high lights nor would I think they will not thrive in your tank.

Rather then posting you a whole booklet here on the lux matter now; I pers find this article very interesting and think you should have a look as well as I couldn't find no corresponding article within our forum I hope the ext link is allowed, otherwise Mods pls remove Minimum Light Threshold | Watts Per Gallon | Rex's Guide to Planted Tanks

Mean Harri 02-06-2010 09:03 PM

I'll nutshell what I know. It appears in the info that I posted above that Lux and lumens mean squat to plants. It's meaningful to us. Plant specific bulbs are generally dimmer looking and purplish looking to us. They are great for the plants but for our viewing pleasure , not so good. One could leave it that way as it is more natural to the plants and fish. Or we can have, as in using the T8 bulbs, one plant bulb and one mid day bulb at around 6700k. The day light bulbs will have a green spike in their spectrum making it look brighter to humans for viewing pleasure but does nothing for plants.
My plan is, as of now, to get two T8 48" bulbs @ 32watts each. The Aqua glo bulb and the Sun glo to brighten it up. The sun glo will still have beneficial spectrum for the plants but includes a green light spike to brighten it up to simulate mid day.

stephanieleah 02-06-2010 09:20 PM

i love good reading. now I have a couple good articles ; )

okay so natalie i've been thinking that the "bright" 10 gal has been looking dim to me and i was thinking of switching out the bulb, but the plants in there are doing fine. well, the dwarf saggitaria no so hot but that was from day one. and the hygro has really taken off (both of them) so i guess my lighting will be okay. I actually wanted it for my other tank though. or both.

Angel079 02-06-2010 10:09 PM

If the sagatteria "not so hot" something ain't fully 100% there in that tank....while its not something as fast growing as eg pennywort it sure spreads new runners fairly quick (Mine planted in mid nov has had several new runners by jan).

What does "not so hot" look like? Yellow leaf? Not growing building runners at all?

stephanieleah 02-06-2010 10:38 PM


Originally Posted by Angel079 (Post 320779)
What does "not so hot" look like? Yellow leaf? Not growing building runners at all?

it means both...for one remember when I was asking about floating swords now staying in the ground? well Ms. Not-so-green-thumb here couldn't even keep her sag in the very fine substrate and kept finding them floating in the tank so I'd have to replant it. So all that root squishing may have had something to do with it.

Yes, you're right...not spreading and some strands are looking brown now. I also put some next to the heater and of course wherever they touched the heater turned brown as well. A couple of them just turned brown or very thin and died. Some plants are doing so well and others not. My java fern is doing well, and anubias, and all the hygro, but my sag and swords and vallis are not spreading at all (that is no new growth). Could it be a matter of the light not diffusing? The sag is right up against the dw.

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