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-   -   Clown Fish Issue HELP (http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/saltwater-fish-diseases/clown-fish-issue-help-35059/)

shaggylawson 01-09-2010 11:06 PM

Clown Fish Issue HELP
 
2 Attachment(s)
My two clown fish have been acting odd over the last week (mainly the bigger one). They use to swim very actively and in the front of the tank, now they stay in the back resting on the sand sometimes on their belly and their side. I finally noticed the bigger one breathing very quickly and saw some type of web or cotton type stuff hanging from its gills. So I finally took the net and got them out into a smaller tank where I could get a closer look. There is lots of pepper type stuff inside the fins and under the mouth. When I watch it closely I can see the pepper stuff moving freely inside the fin but not like it is living but more like a bean in a plastic bag (sorry for all the technical terms, ha, ha I just do not know how do describe this "stuff"). I just thought their behavior was due to stress from recent water issues but they have not been getting any better even though the water has. I attached pictures to help show what I'm talking about. Can anyone tell me what this is and if it is treatable or if they will die no matter what and should be removed from the tank?

Sorry for the large photos I do not know how to get them smaller on this site.

Kellsindell 01-09-2010 11:52 PM

That looks terrible. It could be a parasite, but from the pics it is hard to tell. Please use a flash the next time round to get a better and clear photo. I have some people in my club that are parasite experts, do you mind me sharing the photo's with them? (if they are on any time soon)

shaggylawson 01-10-2010 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kellsindell (Post 303154)
That looks terrible. It could be a parasite, but from the pics it is hard to tell. Please use a flash the next time round to get a better and clear photo. I have some people in my club that are parasite experts, do you mind me sharing the photo's with them? (if they are on any time soon)

I used a flash a few times but it reflects off the glass so this was the best picture I could get. However both of them died overnight. I would still like to know what it is if possible so that I know to look for this a little faster next time and maybe have a chance to save the fish.

Pasfur 01-10-2010 09:46 AM

I sent a message to Dawn. Lets get her to take a look. Probably related to the water chemistry as the tank cycled, caused an infection. Any signs on the other fish?

shaggylawson 01-10-2010 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pasfur (Post 303286)
I sent a message to Dawn. Lets get her to take a look. Probably related to the water chemistry as the tank cycled, caused an infection. Any signs on the other fish?


I do not see any signs of this in the Foxface or Sailfin. The Sailfin is still surprisingly active and the Foxface is still surprisingly not very active, but that is how they have been since adding them to the tank so I see no cause for alarm.

bettababy 01-11-2010 11:31 PM

That appears to be parasitic. The photos are not real clear so its hard for me to tell for sure, and since both fish died now its not going to be possible to get anymore photos for a better diagnosis. I wish I could be of more help.

Is there a quarantine system in place here? Were these fish quarantined before adding them to the main tank?

Because this was present in the main tank then all of the animals in that tank have been exposed, whatever this was. I would suggest watching the others very closely and posting asap if you notice even 1 spot on another fish. If this is indeed parasitic it may still show up in the other fish and require treatment.

This is one of those situations where I wish I had access to the dead fish within 48 hrs of death. A necropsy would have told us exactly what it was and then I could offer much more help in protecting the others. If this turns up again please email me right away before you dispose of the fish. Put the fish into a zip lock baggie (may want to double it) and directly into the coldest part of your refrigerator but do not freeze it. I can talk you through shipping procedures to get the fish to me possibly fast enough to do an effective necropsy, and then you would have the answers you need to save your other fish and to make sure the tank is safe for new fish. I'm sorry, but that is the best I can offer at this point. Should this turn up again, clearer photos would also help in diagnosing the problem and possibly saving the fish. It sounds like the whole process went pretty fast... and is why I offer the necropsy service to you... it may not be possible to diagnose this any other way. I usually charge for necropsy services, but because you are a member here at FF I would do it for free.

Good Luck to you!

Pasfur 01-12-2010 07:12 AM

Thank you Dawn. Brad is working to get a quarantine in place before his next purchase. Wake and I discussed plans with Brad on a Q, so he is in good hands on this part. As always, your expertise on disease is appreciated.

cerianthus 01-12-2010 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bettababy (Post 304365)
That appears to be parasitic. The photos are not real clear so its hard for me to tell for sure, and since both fish died now its not going to be possible to get anymore photos for a better diagnosis. I wish I could be of more help.

Is there a quarantine system in place here? Were these fish quarantined before adding them to the main tank?

Because this was present in the main tank then all of the animals in that tank have been exposed, whatever this was. I would suggest watching the others very closely and posting asap if you notice even 1 spot on another fish. If this is indeed parasitic it may still show up in the other fish and require treatment.

This is one of those situations where I wish I had access to the dead fish within 48 hrs of death. A necropsy would have told us exactly what it was and then I could offer much more help in protecting the others. If this turns up again please email me right away before you dispose of the fish. Put the fish into a zip lock baggie (may want to double it) and directly into the coldest part of your refrigerator but do not freeze it. I can talk you through shipping procedures to get the fish to me possibly fast enough to do an effective necropsy, and then you would have the answers you need to save your other fish and to make sure the tank is safe for new fish. I'm sorry, but that is the best I can offer at this point. Should this turn up again, clearer photos would also help in diagnosing the problem and possibly saving the fish. It sounds like the whole process went pretty fast... and is why I offer the necropsy service to you... it may not be possible to diagnose this any other way. I usually charge for necropsy services, but because you are a member here at FF I would do it for free.

Good Luck to you!


Necropsy services?
Although Ive perform necropsies on my fish for decades to my best ability with whatever apparatus or medium I had, but never for others. Cool idea though.

I would love to see pics of your facility!

shaggylawson 01-14-2010 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bettababy (Post 304365)
That appears to be parasitic. The photos are not real clear so its hard for me to tell for sure, and since both fish died now its not going to be possible to get anymore photos for a better diagnosis. I wish I could be of more help.

Is there a quarantine system in place here? Were these fish quarantined before adding them to the main tank?

Because this was present in the main tank then all of the animals in that tank have been exposed, whatever this was. I would suggest watching the others very closely and posting asap if you notice even 1 spot on another fish. If this is indeed parasitic it may still show up in the other fish and require treatment.

This is one of those situations where I wish I had access to the dead fish within 48 hrs of death. A necropsy would have told us exactly what it was and then I could offer much more help in protecting the others. If this turns up again please email me right away before you dispose of the fish. Put the fish into a zip lock baggie (may want to double it) and directly into the coldest part of your refrigerator but do not freeze it. I can talk you through shipping procedures to get the fish to me possibly fast enough to do an effective necropsy, and then you would have the answers you need to save your other fish and to make sure the tank is safe for new fish. I'm sorry, but that is the best I can offer at this point. Should this turn up again, clearer photos would also help in diagnosing the problem and possibly saving the fish. It sounds like the whole process went pretty fast... and is why I offer the necropsy service to you... it may not be possible to diagnose this any other way. I usually charge for necropsy services, but because you are a member here at FF I would do it for free.

Good Luck to you!

Thanks for the help and offer. I will remember this next (hopefully there is not a next time) and store the fish as you suggested. The good news so far is that the Foxface and Sailfin still show no signs of this issue or any other issue right now.

bettababy 01-15-2010 12:46 AM

Shaggylawson,

I'm happy to hear that your other fish are doing well so far. I asked my husband to take a peek at these photos, I wanted to see if he could confirm my suspicions... and after a lot of staring at your photos, both of us agree that it looks a lot like fish lice, and very possibly your tank is infected. That means even though they may not be showing any signs at present, your other fish are likely to come down with the same problem, and will need treatment to be rid of the problem.

Of course, we can't be 100% sure via internet with blurry photos, but I would say there is a 75% or better chance this was fish lice, so keep a very close and careful watch on the other fish. If you don't yet have quarantine set up, now would be a good time to do it. Its always much safer to medicate in a quarantine tank, and when dealing with parasites, if the fish are out of the system for the right length of time, the parasites die due to lack of a living host to feed from, which saves having to medicate a show tank, main tank with inverts, etc.

Because my visits here are still a bit sporadic, I want to leave you with enough info to help you if you should notice a problem with the other fish. If you can't medicate in a quarantine this medication should be safe for the main tank, but please follow the instruction to the letter and don't overdose. The medication is called Praziquantel. This is not a cheap medication, I must warn you... but the only other I know is safe for those fish but not main tank would be Dimilin, and lately most people seem to be having a hard time in finding it.

The Praziquantel can be found at Fosters & Smith, its called PraziPro
Parasites in Pond, Disease in Pond: PraziPro Praziquantel Treatment

I don't know if somewhere else would have it cheaper, you'd have to search. Keep me posted, I hope you don't end up needing to deal with that... but at least now you are forearmed if you do. Best of luck to you and happy fish keeping!


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