Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources

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-   -   How Can I Keep Blue Ram's (http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/beginner-freshwater-aquarium/how-can-i-keep-blue-rams-30830/)

RandallW20 10-19-2009 05:22 PM

How Can I Keep Blue Ram's
 
I had another post going about the pH that certain fish need leading up to me trying to figure out how I could keep some rams. I decided to make a new post here so as not to change the subject on the other.

Soooooooooo...........
Lets say my water pH out of the tap is 7.5 (which it is)

How could I go about keeping a Blue Ram without adding peat (which changes the water color I believe)
I like clear water......

Wood, special substrate, additives, etc..... What would you do in order to lower the water pH in order to have this fish?

Thanks!

Rohland 10-19-2009 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallW20 (Post 260138)
I had another post going about the pH that certain fish need leading up to me trying to figure out how I could keep some rams. I decided to make a new post here so as not to change the subject on the other.

Soooooooooo...........
Lets say my water pH out of the tap is 7.5 (which it is)

How could I go about keeping a Blue Ram without adding peat (which changes the water color I believe)
I like clear water......

Wood, special substrate, additives, etc..... What would you do in order to lower the water pH in order to have this fish?

Thanks!

Personally I don't know if peat changes the colour of the water, I am pretty sure it raises or lowers the ph, but I think a slight colouration in the water makes it more realistic to the fish's environment, especially with plants and driftwood, because where the fish come from probably isn't crystal clear water.

RandallW20 10-19-2009 05:49 PM

Yeah, I know. And I agree somewhat.
I just don't like the brown/yellow water look. My aquariums are living decorations for my home and the clear water looks alot prettier than yellow or brown water.
Especially if you have company come over and theyre like "Eww, why does your water look like pee?" LOL.....

Rohland 10-19-2009 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallW20 (Post 260156)
Yeah, I know. And I agree somewhat.
I just don't like the brown/yellow water look. My aquariums are living decorations for my home and the clear water looks alot prettier than yellow or brown water.
Especially if you have company come over and theyre like "Eww, why does your water look like pee?" LOL.....

Yeah, I see where your coming from.

joshheat25 10-19-2009 07:12 PM

I have never seen a Blue Ram! lol is that like the flying cow in your picture!

willieturnip 10-19-2009 07:17 PM

Just use peat and run some carbon for a while?

joshheat25 10-19-2009 07:30 PM

edit Remove this.... srry doubled...

Byron 10-19-2009 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallW20 (Post 260138)
I had another post going about the pH that certain fish need leading up to me trying to figure out how I could keep some rams. I decided to make a new post here so as not to change the subject on the other.

Soooooooooo...........
Lets say my water pH out of the tap is 7.5 (which it is)

How could I go about keeping a Blue Ram without adding peat (which changes the water color I believe)
I like clear water......

Wood, special substrate, additives, etc..... What would you do in order to lower the water pH in order to have this fish?

Thanks!

A RO (reverse osmosis) unit is the safest. RO is a process that "filters" water by drawing everything out of it, basically, including the minerals, so the resulting water is comparable to distilled water. The water is so "pure" it will not support aquatic life like fish and plants, so some regular tap water is mixed with it for the aquarium to put back the good stuff.

Peat does work by acidifying the water, but aside from the staining, it has to be replaced as it wears out, much like carbon in a filter. The harder the water, the faster the peat is exhausted. Adding real wood will slightly lower pH by the same means, but in an aquarium you would be unlikely to see more than .2 or .3 of a drop in pH even with a fair bit of wood. Carbon by the way will not soften hard water.

Chemicals are not recommended. pH adjusters work temporarily, then within 12 hours the water's natural buffers counter it, and the resulting pH fluctuation is very hard on the fish; internal health issues, particularly with their immune system, can occur, if not death. Aside from this, adding any chemical to an aquarium is something many of us do not recommend when there are more natural methods. Some of these chemcials can or do have long-term side effects for the fish.

I don't think you know the dKH of your tap water yet, from another thread; if the KH were very low the natural bioilogical processes in the aquarium would eventually lower the pH; my tap water has a pH of 6.8 to 7.0 but a KH of zero. When I set up a tank, it takes about 3 months before the pH in the tank will be down to 6.0 at which point I add dolomite to the filter to keep it from falling further; dolomite adds calcium to the water, the reverse of your problem. But if your KH is high the RO is the best and safest method.

Byron.

MoneyMitch 10-19-2009 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron (Post 260247)
A RO (reverse osmosis) unit is the safest. RO is a process that "filters" water by drawing everything out of it, basically, including the minerals, so the resulting water is comparable to distilled water. The water is so "pure" it will not support aquatic life like fish and plants, so some regular tap water is mixed with it for the aquarium to put back the good stuff.

Peat does work by acidifying the water, but aside from the staining, it has to be replaced as it wears out, much like carbon in a filter. The harder the water, the faster the peat is exhausted. Adding real wood will slightly lower pH by the same means, but in an aquarium you would be unlikely to see more than .2 or .3 of a drop in pH even with a fair bit of wood. Carbon by the way will not soften hard water.

Chemicals are not recommended. pH adjusters work temporarily, then within 12 hours the water's natural buffers counter it, and the resulting pH fluctuation is very hard on the fish; internal health issues, particularly with their immune system, can occur, if not death. Aside from this, adding any chemical to an aquarium is something many of us do not recommend when there are more natural methods. Some of these chemcials can or do have long-term side effects for the fish.

I don't think you know the dKH of your tap water yet, from another thread; if the KH were very low the natural bioilogical processes in the aquarium would eventually lower the pH; my tap water has a pH of 6.8 to 7.0 but a KH of zero. When I set up a tank, it takes about 3 months before the pH in the tank will be down to 6.0 at which point I add dolomite to the filter to keep it from falling further; dolomite adds calcium to the water, the reverse of your problem. But if your KH is high the RO is the best and safest method.

Byron.

Great info there but i would like to add,

There is a importance to match a fishes natrual ph in your aquarium, However lets take a piranna for example. these guys require extremely soft, acidic water (high 6's low 7's). now you can somewhat keep fish in a diffrent ph either lower or higher than what is found in nature. so lets say those pirannas are kept in a tank with a ph of like 8.2. The fish arent going to die overnight or stress and get sick overnight either.... its mainly how you ACCLIMATE the fish, as long as this process is done correctly the fish will be fine. When you do this though overtime it wont neccicarly be good on the fish and in ther long run "could" cause sickness, strees or even death. Now the reason that is is because fish go through a process called osmosis where they they regulate their blood ph to match the water ph and achive that ever so often word of BALANCE. now osmosis takes energy to perform, if they fish is having to spend crazy amounts of its energy just to keep its blood ph the same as the water this will for sure stress the fish and may lead to illness. But that is why you can drop fish out of their ph as long as you acclimate them over time. your ram should be fine in your tap since the ph will loweritself after the cycle. just dont throw him in like a 8.0 ph.

RandallW20 10-19-2009 10:39 PM

Your right, I dont know what my KH is. How could I test this? Do they sell KH tests at say petsmart like the pH, Ammonia, and nitrate?

Although....... I don't think ya'll understand. My pH is around 7.5 out of the tap and in my community tropical that has been set up for a year it remains the same at about 7.5 There will be no cycle for it to change.

If I was using RO water and mixing with tap. How would I mix? Or do I just use trial and error til I figure out the appropriate mixture?

Thanks!


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