Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources

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sharkie chomp 10-05-2009 11:00 PM

is it big enough?
so I picked up a 2 gallon octagon tank and was wondering if it would be big enough to form into a salt water tank with a clown fish, a sea anemone, and a piece of live rock? or any other suggestions would be good.

Pasfur 10-06-2009 07:00 AM

A 2 gallon tank would really be pushing the limits. But keep in mind, the evolution of mini reef environments over the last several years has really been amazing. A lot of things are possible that we would not have even attempted in the past.

That being said, small aquariums are for very advanced marine aquarists. Given that you are asking questions, this fact alone suggests to me that you probably need more experience in the marine hobby before attempting such a set up.

Have you ever kept a saltwater tank?

sharkie chomp 10-06-2009 01:32 PM

my brother had a salt water tank, I've always had a freshwater and right now it's a95 gal. lake malawi tank. I've seen many small reef tanks, like the nano cube that are 8 gallons and just wasn't sure exactly what the limitations are as far as going smaller. it was just a thought.

willieturnip 10-06-2009 03:04 PM

The smaller the tank, the harder it is to keep parameters in the pink.

Even keeping the temperature in that small of a tank would be bloody hard, let alone everything else.

sharkie chomp 10-07-2009 02:54 AM

well, I spoke with a coworker who used to have her own pet store and showed her the tank and asked her opinion. apparently, she has a 3 gal. reef tank and said it would work as long as I can get mini lights to cover he requirements for a salt water tank, which aren't really sold in stores. however, I do order from a company online that has something that will prolly work. I would just replace the hood with the light fixture. Or I might be able to get someone in a car club i belong to, to fabricate some bulb setup with the hood that came with my kit since he does all the lights we use. as for temp. she said I could get away without having a heater seeing as that many people use chillers on salt water tanks anyway. it doesn't get too cold or too hot where i live. the filter is under gravel and she said it would be fine.

Pasfur 10-08-2009 06:06 AM

This is not a freshwater system. It is not as simple as taking a series of steps, buying the correct equipment, asking for advice, and then having a beautiful display. This mindset is why people are not successful in the marine hobby. People want to take a rocket ship to the moon before they learn to ride a bicycle.

You have to learn this hobby with experience. We can tell you the basics of how to increase your chance of success, or decrease you odds of failure, but there is no amount of book knowledge that is going to help you when you try to do a 2 gallon mini reef. You are attempting to skip years of hands on experience and jump right into an extremely difficult project. Odds of this system lasting longer than 6 months without crashing are slim to none. You simply do not have the skill set to do this, and it shows from comments you made above.

Bottom line, the information your friend has given you is so wrong that everyone who reads your thread is shaking their head and not even sure if it is worth their time to post an answer. First, increasing temperature is not a concern. Keeping the temperature stable is a stress factor making the entire system at increased risk of disease and infection. Second, using an undergravel fillter on a marine system is ridiculous. U/G filters trap detritus which causes spikes in phosphate and Nitrate. Nitrate stresses the corals and fish, causing disease. Phosphates bond with carbonates, removing them from your buffer system, lowering alkalinity, and causing massive swings in calcium levels.

Keep in mind, I could buy a new car and drive it for 20,000 miles without an oil change. However, that would not make it intelligent for you to do as I do. There are methods that are tried and true in this hobby. Methods that have been well documented over the last 40 years in all the aquarium literature and online. You need to use a method that has a proven track record of success.

sharkie chomp 10-08-2009 12:18 PM

^ok, well people like you are the reason I only talk to my actual pet store friends ( friends that have and have had successfull businesses) versus coming on here and asking total strangers. I was just wanting to hear how many other people have done stuff like this. Like I stated before it's been done and I know the pet store owner who did it very well and trust them. not to mention the fact that I do have more experience than you might think, you don't know me, so you don't know. questions are only questions. I never stated how many yrs I have, but for your info (which it doesn't matter) I've had fish tanks my whole life and they've been at dif. levels and have all been successful, and that's because I work at making sure they are done right regardless what some stranger may think is possible. You are not the person I have been talking to everyday at work who owns and runs a pet store. And while I'm at it...I would never go to you about advice on a car...everything I do I do very well and succeed at. I am most certain that I know more than you about cars on any given day. So, with that being said, you can do whatever you want to my account since you are a moderator for this site, because you have made my experience on here not a pleasant one and I am a member of other forums that treat people with more respect than you have shown me on here.

and just one thing about my last post on here that you judged...the whole temp. thing was a statement about where I live meaning that it doesn't go up or down very much, which would help in keeping a stable temp. in my house/tank with or without a heater.

Pasfur 10-08-2009 06:50 PM

My gut instinct was to apologize for upsetting Sharkie. But after rereading this thread I've changed my mind. There is nothing at all about my post that was rude or assuming. In fact, Sharkie is the one who made the assumption that this web site is just like every other site. I receive an amazing amount of email and messages from readers on this forum thanking us for being patient, kind, and helpful. I really appreciate the positive feedback that many of you have given, and it makes me very willing to speak open and honest on a thread such as this.

I do want to respond for the purpose of others who are reading this thread and actually want help from those of us with experience. First, you should know that nobody is paid to be here. We are here because we enjoy this hobby and want to help others. We volunteer our time and receive nothing from it. None of us have anything to gain or loose by answering your questions or helping you be successful, other than the enjoyment of the hobby. This isn't a battle of wits or an attempt to establish some pecking order. This is a group of people who are trying to help each other be successful.

That being said, it is actually VERY possible to quickly tell the experience level of a fishkeeper. The questions that are asked and statements that are made tell an experienced fishkeeper a TON of information about the background and experience of the person posting. When you post a question on this forum, you should not be mad or upset if the answer is not the answer you are looking for. We are going to be honest, and are going to shoot it to you straight.

Also, a disagreement is just that. There is absolutely nothing about the post above that is against forum rules or would result in a moderator taking action to remove a member.

zaitmi 10-09-2009 09:41 AM

Cool it Sharkie.
Just listen Pasfur.
Here he Rules.
He will help u every single day.
Take care for your Nano Reef.
(Mine is 29 Gallon) Coming up project.
In Marine - Patience is the name of the Game Bro.

sharkie chomp 10-09-2009 02:30 PM

^ I left out details since I didn't feel it was necesary. Obviously MOST people haven't been able to do this project that can and will succeed at. Yes, I have a freshwater right now, but I do know how to do a salt water too. It's just been over 6 yrs. since I last messed with one and am only reconfirming things about it on here. Infact, as far as this project goes I've already added 2 people to the list that have done it and done it right (with a much higher bioload than whatI plan on doing). And since ya'll seem to make assumptions due to my lack of history teaching here goes... I started my hobby on with a 2 gal. tank 20 yrs. ago and have only gone up from there. A 29 gal. tank was another tank I had and then I wanted a bigger one for larger fish, so I got A 95 gal. I've switched it over from a successful gourami/angel tank to a successful lake malawi tank (doing so with the gourami in it and having them actually loving the new "settings"). My fish have never been happier and I enjoy watching them play and mate. I also currently have a very happy "dinosaur eel" in my tank that just loves his home and doesn't cause any problems nor gets picked on by other fish. I know all about patience, my life has been nothing but patience. I know that a 2 gal reef tank is going to be hard. I know 2 pet store owners that have them going right now as we type. they don't have heaters or chillers on them and keep temp. right, and they both have the same undergravel filter I have. They just have more in theirs than I plan on having, and yes, I said successful. Ug is just an old school thing and they actually make heaters for small 2-5 gal. tanks, as well as lighting specific for corals and reefs. My questions have only been reconfirming things I already know with hopes of finding someone on here that's done a small reef tank under 8 gal. to see how they have theirs and what all might be in theirs.

i WILL do this setup, and when I do, it WILL be successful as I will take the steps to make sure it is. When I do IF I still have my acct. on here or even come back, I will post up pictures just how successful it is and prove you all wrong. Since you all seem to underestimate me. I am all about proving people wrong when they say something can't be done. Watch and learn is what I say to that.

{mod comments: I have removed everything from this thread that is not related to the topic being discussed. - Pasfur}

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