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My new (and first) tank-hints tips etc

8K views 79 replies 9 participants last post by  Nilet699 
#1 ·
First off...... hi people :)

Ok, So my little story..... I had decided that saving all my money had become boring, decided to treat myself and rather than buy a new 50" plasma, thought I'd get something I'd always wanted.... I'm 25 :) .. and get my first tank. Nearly went reef after chatting to a friend who actually has tropical, but Mrs said NO! And I'm kinda glad too.

So....I went out and bought myself an aqua one eurostyle 80, 180 ltr tank. I likes it :)

I will upload pics later as currently working..well... if someone would kindly link me the how to, or I'll find it once home.

Tank has now cycled using bottle cheat BUT one of my pieces of wood has not yet sank in my water butt and is stopping me from putting fish in as its so big it would cause the poor things too much stress/being squashed.

So, gives me a little time though to chat about where I want to go with the tank etc with you lot hopefully :)

Originally I wanted balas but have now decided that the tank would not suit them after too long....... it's (cm) 80 x 76 x 40. Works out at 215 ltr but after substrate and lil missing at top 180 sounds about right.

Ok, it will be a planted tank, have already had fun putting in one piece of wood that's kind of like a mini cave and attaching 2 anubias to the top of it, have other plants - can't remember the name now - currently in tank waiting for my other wood which is like a root system which I will plant them between etc creating nice shelter etc. Wish I could upload pics now.......

So, these are the fish I was interested in and was hoping for some advise on creating a good community;

Beosmani rainbow
Galaxy rasbora
Clown loach
Sunset platy
Couple of diff plecos- candy strip, well any of the stripey ones. Haha
Balas :-(
Red tail black shark
Black neon tetra.

And am always willing to take any advice/s suggestions etc.

Thanks in advance for any replies :)
 
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#2 ·
Those tank dimensions will allow you to do some really cool aquascaping. Unfortunately, you have a few fish on your list that might not work out. That being said, the total area of your tank might make up for the lack of length. The clown loach is not a good candidate no matter what because of their eventual size, same thing for the balas. If you get the smaller plecos, they will work out. Many folks say that a red tailed shark needs a minimum of a 48 inch tank; however, most 48 inch long tanks are only 12-15 inches wide. Your tank has much more surface area than those, so maybe the red tailed shark would work. Let's wait to here from some of the experts. Have fun and best of luck.
 
#3 ·
Welcome to Tropical Fish Keeping forum.:-D

I'm going to point you to our fish profiles, second tab from the left in the blue bar across the top of the page. You will note that some of the fish names shaded in your initial post; that is because you typed the name exactly as it appears in our profile and it will become a link to that profile. All of the fish mentioned are in the profiles. To make it quick for you, here are the names as links:
Clown Loach
Black Neon Tetra
Boeseman Rainbowfish
Celestial Pearl Danio [Galaxy Rasbora is another common name]
Platy
Bala Shark
Red Tailed Shark
Common Pleco

You will find info on minimum tank sizes, numbers in the group for shoaling fish, compatibility issues, etc in the profiles. I won't repeat what you will find there, but you have a few serious issues with the fish that you will find out about. And you can always ask question here.:)

Byron.
 
#5 ·
Sorry fish monger, that width is right for mine too, the 76cm relates to the height. I couldn't fit anything longer or deeper into the alcove I've put it in so went as tall as I could find.

Tanks been up for 11 days now and all readings etc so spiked as should. Plants have been in for a week now and are fine. Literally just waiting on the wood so can plant the tank how I want it.

I have read all them profiles thanks Byron and I can indeed see a multitude of problems in parameters etc. Sad face. Has made me think though as I plan to add a second larger tank in 6-12 months, how big would I need for a bala and clown loach tank? And how long till they grew out of my current?

Main thing is I'm not a fan of tiny fish, neons tetras etc, just not my thing, I'd much prefer to have far fewer 3/4/5/6/7 inch fish in my tank than have a 100 0.5 inch fish there. So, any suggestions where to start building from with a nice centre piece larger fish that I can build a community around?
 
#6 · (Edited)
The Bala profile suggests a tank of 6 to 8 feet in length. Balas and Clown loaches like to be kept in groups, so I suggest 125 as a minimum size tank for keeping both. 150 or 180 would be even better.

I keep Balas in a 220, and I plan on adding Clown loaches as well, I love your choice of fish. My 220 is, sadly, only 6 feet long, so it's no better than a 150 or 180 for the balas, which need the swimming length as they mature.

Even as babies, my balas used the entire length of a 4 ft 55 gallon tank. If your tank is 80 cm long, which is just over 2 and a half feet, I would not keep balas or clown loaches of any age. That is a really short tank. Apologies if I misunderstood the dimensions. I can't imagine a 50 gallon tank is only 2 and a half feet long. That's the same length as a 20 gallon long tank, so I may have missed something.

As for the second part of your question, some species of Rainbowfish grow to about 4", and they grow high as well as long as they mature. They are a beautiful fish that come in many colors. Mine are super fast and active. In those tank dimensions, however, they will be essentially swimming in circles (which may be fine for them, I have no idea, Byron or someone would know better). Something less active may be better for a tank of your dimensions.
 
#7 ·
Model 80 Aquarium size is 80cm x 42cm x 64cm high, the volume is 180 litres.
Cabinet measures 80cm x 42 x 76cm high
So I was slightly mistaking the dimensions. But had the overall capacity right...

80X42x64 = 215 040 x 0.001 = 215.04 litre capacity.
Which equates to;
215 litres = 47.2933688 Imperial gallons
215 litres = 56.7969913 US gallons

80Cm is 2.62 ft in length.

Hope this helps?



As for the balas clowns etc why I'm wondering about if they could Start for the first 6 months in my current tank is I was going to buy a 600 litre/200us gallon tank originally but Mrs said to start smaller... which I'm now regretting so would no doubt buy anyway 6 months from now, why I'm wondering about the approx growth rate early on.

Which choices did you mean Canadian?
 
#8 · (Edited)
I neglected to say....



Welcome to the forum!



I meant the Balas and the Clowns. I am fans of both.

I personally don't think Balas should be in a two and a half foot tank for ANY amount of time, 6 OR 12 months. It's too short for them. Even when they're small they need swimming room.

If you're getting a big tank in 6 months anyway, why not wait and get the Balas in six months, when you get the big tank, and stock this tank with something that can thrive in it for the long haul?

If you had a standard 55 gallon long tank, which is 48", I would say you could probably house some Balas for 6 months, as long as they were purchased very small, but I wouldn't put them in a 31" tank.
 
#10 ·
Ok you terrible people ;-) you've convinced me of what I already know I suppose. Darn you all. Haha :)

Considering my tank dimensions etc and a max size of 3inches how about boesami rainbows as a centre piece?

I also just threw away 2 large pieces of furniture...... stage 1 of acquiring a 6ft tank :)
 
#12 ·
Your killing me C.F.! :)

I wasn't sure about this as read in multiple locations that you need approx 6x there length, so I thought by having 10x I would be ok?

Also, it's 32 inches :p
 
#13 · (Edited)
We'll split the difference, since 80 cm is 31.4961 inches. I don't think the .4961 of an inch I shorted you will tip the balance one way or another.

I am unfamiliar with the above guidelines, but if this is the case you will have almost 10 x if you get all females. Males can get up to and above 4", but that still gives you more than 6x.

I just read a profile on another site that suggests "31.5 inches | 80 centimeters" as a minimum tank size for a group of Boesmani. So they could be fine.
 
#16 ·
If you're looking for bottom feeders to go with Rainbows in a 4 ft tank, I would suggest Zebra loaches.

They don't hide all day like some loaches, and they're not aggressive like other loaches. They swim right along with my Rainbows all day. They're actually really entertaining.
 
#19 · (Edited)
I agree with the lot tbh of what you just said.......ive now bolded the ones im most intersted in i think. Though from them you can rule out the kissing - size, and tiger's - nippy. (possibly) So i'm getting down to a few nice ones to choose from now :D

That pleco is very nice, i liked the peppermint one because it grows to a maximum of 7inches and not overly active (from what ive read), so now i have two nice ones to consider thank you.

Hmm, i had read something about feeding with the rainbows like that, which is a shame as i like the dwarf gourami's, doesnt rule them out completely but a definite consideration and something to look up further.

zebra danios is another fish people keep saying to me, easy to keep, pretty, blah blah, but not quite sure on them.

does anyone have any experience of keeping tiger barbs with rainbows? i would be interested. I'm also going to look up if you can mix the green and orange, just because i want to know tbh.

Camouflage isnt a colour? :p
 
#23 ·
Yes these fish were named as suitable to house with the boese. Obviously not all together etc and I have taken to rooting out the ones I think might be suitable for myself, now just need to research little further into required phs etc etc and see how it actually pans out.
 
#24 ·
You know about our profiles? All this data is included for each species. When you get the list weeded out, post and we can comment if we see issues.

Wherever that initial compilation came from, I wouldn't trust them. There are some major issues with that combo. Not everyone knows all the aspects of compatibility that factor into a successful community aquarium.

Byron.
 
#25 ·
ok, so monday 1800 i introduce my first fish into the tank. I got 6 rosy tetras. schooled nicely straight away, very happy :)

Part of this is used bio cycling kick start majiga in and 7 days later wanted to help it along, impatience....

checked levels today 24 hrs after, they havent eaten yet, they read

Am: 0.50
Nitrite: 0.4
Nitrate: around 3-5 ppm

So i immediately make the decision to do a water change to lower the trites.
Change around 80 ltrs from a 180 litre tank. so around 45%.

take readings immediately afterwards;

nitrites down to 0.2

Know ill be up late, new BF3 dl :) so decide to give it 6 hours and then est agin at 4am :(

do so, full readings;

Am: 0.25
Nitrites: 0.01
Nitrates: Around 4. Not east to read with markers,at 1 and 5.....

So, this is good, over 6 hours Nitrites lowered themselvesfrom 0.2 to 0.01

In that time lights went and stayed off, minus blue LED spotlight. I have plants in there, 2 Anubias attached to moala wood. (think thats right-meh) and 4 plants unknown that will be planted between ''branches'' when wood ready!. LOOKing them up now..... they are green cabomba's. Did the plants steal the trites? OR cycle going right? -Not sure as nitrates still so low...is this bad?

Sorry all over the place post, was running test as typing, and filling in my book
 
#26 ·
ok, so monday 1800 i introduce my first fish into the tank. I got 6 rosy tetras. schooled nicely straight away, very happy :)

Part of this is used bio cycling kick start majiga in and 7 days later wanted to help it along, impatience....

checked levels today 24 hrs after, they havent eaten yet, they read

Am: 0.50
Nitrite: 0.4
Nitrate: around 3-5 ppm

So i immediately make the decision to do a water change to lower the trites.
Change around 80 ltrs from a 180 litre tank. so around 45%.

take readings immediately afterwards;

nitrites down to 0.2

Know ill be up late, new BF3 dl :) so decide to give it 6 hours and then est agin at 4am :(

do so, full readings;

Am: 0.25
Nitrites: 0.01
Nitrates: Around 4. Not east to read with markers,at 1 and 5.....

So, this is good, over 6 hours Nitrites lowered themselvesfrom 0.2 to 0.01

In that time lights went and stayed off, minus blue LED spotlight. I have plants in there, 2 Anubias attached to moala wood. (think thats right-meh) and 4 plants unknown that will be planted between ''branches'' when wood ready!. LOOKing them up now..... they are green cabomba's. Did the plants steal the trites? OR cycle going right? -Not sure as nitrates still so low...is this bad?

Sorry all over the place post, was running test as typing, and filling in my book
Nitrates are not as important here as keeping ammonia and nitrite at zero. And the fast growing plants should achieve this. Nitrates should remain low too.
 
#28 ·
Well, as you said, you need the ammonia and nitrites to be zero. Don't be afraid to add more plants...substrate planted and especially fast growing stem / floating plants. Needless to say, keep up water changes and do more often if you see ammonia rise. The addition of the plants should really help with that.
 
#31 ·
OK, so after lots of 40-70% water changes and bit of graft, my nitrite levels seem to have balanced out, at zero... last 48 hours highest iv had is <0.01 :)

So, hopefully this will remain. I will wait for it to be 0 for at least 7-10 days so that i know my tank is stable, else rinse and repeat.

However, this has now enabled me to think about what i may possibly add next....

Right now my preference is to add 2 dwarf neon gouramis next,in around 2 weeks, followed my 3 boesemani rainbows maybe a month or so after, followed (maybe) finally by a small pleco (suggestions?!?!) Ive also thought about adding to the 6 rosy tetras at some point, or if my bioload could handle it (help here please!!!) a second school of 6ish possibly. Not sure if my tank could handle that though...

Currently running Aqua One Aquis 750 Series II Canister filter and plenty of live plants- with more to come as my filters. Have thought about upgrading this though, then using this filter to run an approx 120 ltr quarantine tank. (After which to convert to cichlid tank...but thats another matter...)

Just hoping for some suggestions regarding my original 'line-up' and any suggestions etc welcome...
 
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#33 ·
Right now my preference is to add 2 dwarf neon gouramis next,in around 2 weeks, followed my 3 boesemani rainbows maybe a month or so after, followed (maybe) finally by a small pleco (suggestions?!?!) Ive also thought about adding to the 6 rosy tetras at some point, or if my bioload could handle it (help here please!!!) a second school of 6ish possibly. Not sure if my tank could handle that though...
The Boeseman Rainbowfish is a shoaling fish, and in the profile it gives six as absolute minimum, though more are better. It also mentions a 4-foot tank so I assume we are now considering the 4-foot tank, not the original in this thread; area as in the surface area of the substrate is more important than depth of water for active fish.

I wouldn't add gourami to this mix though. As also noted in the profile, rainbows are active fish and should not be combined with sedate or quiet fish, like the gourami.

Which brings me to the Rosy Tetra, which are also on the quiet side. But these would probably manage better with the rainbow, though it is not a combination I personally would choose because of the activity issue, but also the water parameters. And these are not mentioned. Boeseman rainbows do not do well in soft water, whiile the Rosys are the opposite. Aside from this, I would increase the group; six as the minimum simply means that, minimum, with more always being better. I have had this species in groups close to 15 and they have been very happy. But quiet, remaining in a group under plants (they do not like overhead light) and out of the filter flow (also don't like currents).

A small pleco species (some grow around 4-5 inches, others get enormous so watch out;-)) would be OK with any of this, so far.

Byron.
 
#32 ·
If you like longer term planning, and have a high degree of confidence in your future tank, the clown loach is a fun specimen. Mine has proven quite hardy, eats very well, and is very entertaining to watch. Probably my favorite fish right now if I was forced to rank order them. It's a race against time with the room renovations, purchasing and setting up the new bigger tank (75 g), against his growth rate.
 
#34 ·
Sorry, busy few days with work....

Thanks all, your continued advice is great!

Ok, so I'm just going to wait till I get the 4ft tank before adding the boesmani's. That's a cert.
One question I did have though Byron, both a friend if mine And the LFS have a boese and gourami tank, which both seem very happy etc together, so is it these got lucky? Adding at a young age etc?

Just wondering as just got myself a 60 ltr ready to go quarantine tank and was unsurewhether to get the gouramis or not. I'm just getting mixed info.....


And still considering plecs to.... so much choice! Someone suggested the golden nugget to me, anyone have any experience with it? Average size etc, I read a maximum of 6 inches.....
 
#35 ·
One question I did have though Byron, both a friend if mine And the LFS have a boese and gourami tank, which both seem very happy etc together, so is it these got lucky? Adding at a young age etc?

Just wondering as just got myself a 60 ltr ready to go quarantine tank and was unsurewhether to get the gouramis or not. I'm just getting mixed info.....
You will always encounter differing opinions on combining certain species, that is to be expected. And usually there are no rules "cut in stone." There are possible and sometimes probable issues, and the wise aquarist follows those to avoid risk to the fish. Individual fish within a species can behave differently for reasons science does not fully understand; but after all, so do people.:)

Gourami are slow, sedate fish. They should never be forced to live in an environment with active fish. And rainbows (the larger species) are active swimmers. This is why barbs and danios do not go well with gourami and angelfish, but rasbora and the more sedate characins generally do.

Whenever I hear that the fish in a tank are "doing fine" I really have to ask how one knows this. There are obvious things that can clue us in of course, but not always. An obvious example. Most members here will tell you that a 20g tank is not sufficient space for an Oscar, life-long. But there will be some who will say they have this and the fish is fine. The fish is eating, and it lives many years. It "looks" fine. But we know it is not fine.

Once you confine a fish to an enclosed volume of water, the fish is at your mercy. They deserve the best, not experiments. I was reading an article last week in which the author commented that we are unwise to think we can change a fish that has evolved through natural selection over thousands of years, just by putting it in a tank.

Byron.
 
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#38 ·
Hmmm..... darn these fish are complicated. Good thing I love to just sit there and while away hours watching them :)

Well I was thinking of going with a pair of dwarf neons tbh, so is there others suited to these, or am I better off leaving them as the only gouramis in the tank?
 
#40 ·
Well I was thinking of going with a pair of dwarf neons tbh, so is there others suited to these, or am I better off leaving them as the only gouramis in the tank?
Are we thinking the 4-foot tank here? Or the 3-foot? I guess I can respond for both. In the 3-foot, one gourami species (of these medium size species). In the 4-foot, you might have better luck. But again, individual fish can throw the wrench into this.
 
#39 ·
I had a moonlight gourami get skiinny in my Rainbowfish tank and I am sure it was because the Rainbowfish were beating him to the food.

That 6 minimum, can that be including other Rainbowfish? I have 6 Irian Red, 3 Blue and 3 Bosemani and they all seem to school together. No signs of racism or segregation amongst them.

I keep my Rainbows with zebra loaches, catfish, and bristlenose pleco and everyone seems to get along famously. It's a busy tank, I tell ya.

Everyone follows me when I walk by the tank. Except the Catfish. They hate me, lol.
 
#41 · (Edited)
I think it's wise also to wait on the larger tank for the Bosesmani Rainbows. We had 2 that came with a tank we bought and a mixture of other small community fish. I did not know much about them, but as I learned, we found out we had a breeding pair. The male has more orange and the female has more purple. They were just fine until the male reached puberty and one day I noticed he had this neon green stripe doing down the center of his head. I was afraid something was wrong with him, looked it up and found out. He was ready to tango...but the female was not interested. I contacted a friend of mine who is a breeder and he had been wanting a breeding group of Rainbows, so we traded some fish with him. He placed our 2 in a planted tank with several (I am not sure what the ratio was) other rainbows and sent me a pic. These fish look totally awesome in a planted tank with some small driftwood!!! If you go with these, try to copy their natural habitat as much as possible. You will not be disappointed, but... you may have some fry to deal with also if you have males/females. They are beautiful to watch when you have males and females courting, I would not put anything else in the tank with them. Don't you think it would be great to have some babies!
 
#42 ·
For the gourami byron I was thinking for the 3 ft tank so the boesmani can go in the 4 ft.

And I was actually thinking of having all males in the other tank Malawi- for the reason of Not having little ones. I just wouldn't have the room now for an endless supply of them. Lol. Adding females later when I get a 6ft is a better option. In my mind at least.....
 
#43 ·
For the gourami byron I was thinking for the 3 ft tank so the boesmani can go in the 4 ft.

And I was actually thinking of having all males in the other tank Malawi- for the reason of Not having little ones. I just wouldn't have the room now for an endless supply of them. Lol. Adding females later when I get a 6ft is a better option. In my mind at least.....
With the rainbows, or for that matter any of the egg laying fish, it is better to always have a mix of male and female. Some species require specific ratio of m/f because of their behaviours, but most are OK with a mix roughly equal. I would not intentionally get all males, or all females.

The reason is natural behaviours. If you want to experience the fish being themselves, this will be much more likely with a mix. Some species have quite interesting and beautiful behaviours and it would be a shame to miss these. And there is little doubt but that the fish will be less stressed and thus healthier if they can interact naturally as nature intended.

As for young surviving, this can occur but in most cases few and far between. Within the confines of an aquarium the parents will often eat the eggs when they find them, and if there are other fish in the tank they will almost certainly know what is taking place and stand guard waiting for the first eggs. I see this all the time, and it is rare than an egg hatches, or the fry then survive. And if any do, there is then the issue of food. Some will find live microscopic food, but this will not be sufficient for many.

Byron.
 
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#44 ·
Very good advice Byron. This does not pertain to having all males in a tank, but it reminded me of a situation we had with one female German Blue Dwarf Ram that we had taken in with some fish from an individual getting out of the hobby. After a few months of having this adorable Ram (named Koolaid because of the blue lipstick on her lips) she started pseudo spawning even though there were no males in the tank with her. This happened several times about every 2 months. We were trying to find a home for her with someone who had a male and was wanting to breed, but could not. I know she was carrying eggs because of her red belly, never saw her lay them or any fish eating them. Her last pseudo spawn, she must have been egg bound or something, but her belly swelled up as usual and was red but she must not have been able to pass the eggs for some reason. I tried feeding her peas thinking that might help with the constipation, but she would not eat. The water parameters in the tank were fine, all of the other fish were fine, she was not being picked on, had not changed her food, no other explanation. She just sat at the bottom of the tank and would not get up, RIP Koolaid we miss you!

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