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This is a discussion on gupgram within the Introduce Yourself forums, part of the Welcome to Tropical Fish Keeping category; --> Here is just one quote of many from sites like guppytripod, guppy.com and more. "The water The aquarium should be cycled and you should ...

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Old 06-29-2011, 07:30 PM   #41
 
API salt and guppies...

Here is just one quote of many from sites like guppytripod, guppy.com and more.
"The water
The aquarium should be cycled and you should make sure that the water quality is kept at an ideal level at all times.

Guppies live in fresh and brackish environments in the wild and adding some aquarium salt to the breeding aquarium is a good idea. One tablespoon (15 ml) of salt is enough for 10 gallons (40 L) of water. "

Also there are many who say yes, many who say no. Guppies adapt very well to high PH but not to low. Better not to mess tyring to lower it all the time. Same with a lot of people with Corries. One guy has kept guppies for 17 years, with the salt and his Corries are still living and are about 7 years old. His fathers has some 9 and 11 years old. Same with certain kinds of ottos. Many have said it is a myth to have salt as it is tooix to plants. Depends on the plants and your water. My corries, I have had them almost 3 months and they are doing great. The ottos going on the 3rd week. I however am more conservative with the salt and used only have the amount recommended when I first set up athe tank, and only once since at 1/2 the recommended amount. Also many make the mistake of adding salt with every water change. There lies the issue. Salt does not evaporate so if you keep adding each time you do a water change it builds up. A good quick overall for guppy care is this link: Guppy Facts I know I am new to a lot but feel that there are so many different positions on different things because after all, most do not have the same water typ as eveyone. Just an educated guess there.

I just hope I finally found out the reason for the algae bloom! No wonder could not figure it out. I do not over feed, the params are good, proper water changes. But to discover early sun in the morning from the North windows for about I think 2+ hours this time of year! Duh! I did change 6 gallons of water today. The plants Byron recommended, the first I got last week are looking very well. I am concerned about the root systems and need info no fertilizers I have read about, but don't want to do anytihing to add to algae bloom. So do they need it or wait and see? Byron had be me get Lutea and Brazillian Pennywort. Have a new light bulb, all I could get. was Glo series 20 Watt. At least for now I can see the plants and fish! Sure will pull the mini blinds down and cover with the light wt. pink lap robe I was using when I thought the light was only hitting a little of the corner, it will go over all but the end facing our living room.
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Old 06-29-2011, 08:13 PM   #42
 
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Salt is a topic on which there will be differing opinions. I will just offer a few comments from my research.

First on the guppy habitat, while it is true that a few populations do occur in brackish water, in its habitat it thrives best in freshwater (be it swamp, ditch, mountain stream) with thick aquatic plant and algae growth.

Second, guppies like all livebearers must have medium hard or harder water with a basic or alkaline pH. Fish that need these conditions usually manage better with salt in the aquarium. But that does not mean they should have it, or that it is risk-free.

Third, salt does affect fish; it is detrimental to freshwater fish and plants in varying degrees. To understand why, we must understand what salt does in water.

Salt makes the water more dense than the same water without salt. The aquarium contains water. The bodies of fish and plant leaves also contain water [just as we do--we are, what is it, 70-some percent water?]. The water in the aquarium and the water in the fish/plant are separated by a semi-permeable layer which is the cell. Water can pass through this cell. When either body of water is more dense, the other less-dense body of water will pass through the membrane to equalize the water on both sides.

Water is constantly passing through the cells of fish by osmosis in an attempt to equate the water inside the fish (which is more dense) with the water in the aquarium. Put another way, the aquarium water is diluting the fish's body water until they are equal. Freshwater fish regularly excrete this water through respiration and urination. This is the issue behind pH differences as well as salt and other substances. It increases the fish's work--the kidney is used in the case of salt--which also increases the fish's stress in order to maintain their internal stability. Also, the fish tends to produce more mucus especially in the gills; the reason now seems to be due to the irritant property of salt--the fish is trying to get away from it.

Dr. Stanley Weitzman, who is Emeritus Research Scientist at the Department of Ichthyology of the Smithsonian Institute in Washington and an acknowledged authority on characoid fishes, writes that 100 ppm of salt is the maximum for characins, and there are several species that show considerable stress leading to death at 60 ppm. 100 ppm is equal to .38 of one gram of salt per gallon of water. One level teaspoon holds six grams of salt, so 1 tsp of salt per gallon equates to more than 15 times the tolerable amount. Livebearers have a higher tolerance (mollies sometimes exist in brackish water) so the salt may be safe for them.

Plants: when salt is added to the aquarium water, the water inside the plant cells is less dense so it escapes through the cells. The result is that the plant literally dries out, and will wilt. I've so far been unable to find a measurement of how much salt will be detrimental to plants; all authorities I have found do note that some species are more sensitive than others, and all recommend no salt in planted aquaria. There are some species that can do well in limited salt.


Byron.
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Old 06-29-2011, 10:09 PM   #43
 
Thumbs up That was wonderful info!

I know I have read on most guppy sights about adding salt so when I was really new, I did as fancy guppiers said as I have fancy guppies. However, as I said, the first time I only use full dose. Back in first of May, on one of the water changes, I did add some but not quite half what was recommended. I do know that in spite of what some have said, one place made so much sense to me. Don't keep adding salt at every water change cause it does not evaproate. It just gets stronger.

I SO appreciate your knowledgeable info and helping me to under stand it. I have not lost any guppies despite the LFS telling me I was cycled but not, so a bacteria bloom and then to the algae bloom, but have done all those water changes since first of April when i started so not sure there would even be any salt left? I mean, I have added more gravel, plants and a few more fish. Now the gentelmen that had tanks for years using salt, well, in all those years, they probably have their own stock and haven't bought any for a long time. (17 & 19 years) As far as I have read, the guppies of today and thefancy guppy which many are by breeding is more delicate.

Back in 1950-1977, we never saw fancy ones, only ones that had round black, orange, blue,yellow or purple spots and that was all. My Mom had guppies in a 10 gallon tank, she first got in 1959, then in 1972 I started with some she gave me. We both had a box filter, heater, well water NO testing what so ever, no water changes always had clear water, when Momma's had babies we scooped them up and put them in pint or quart jars and never heard of cycling or any thing. They just TRHIVED!! And imagine the babies in canning jars, no filter, no heat (we put them on our registers in the winter, yet they grew, lost very very few. We gave a lot away and those survived and thrived! For us , how did they die after all those years? We had a wicked blizzard, no electricity for over 5 days in 1977! NO Heat! We both lost them all after all those years. So now here I am in 2011 trying and guess you can imagine all the new things and stuff! Overwhelming! And to all specially Byron, I do give heartfelt thank yous! I am a newbie since so much has changed and the hardiness of guppies. I wonder what happend to all the simple spotted ones from back in the '50's-70's? That was all we could find and at Woolworth's at that!

Um that is why I am a gup GRAM! My Mom is now 84. I will be 62 in Sept.

Do any of you maybe umm, senior folks have tropical fish stories from back in time? I would love to hear them. I hope I don't offend anyone by asking us 'older' folks this question.

You younger ones will have to keep us in line! God Bless!
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Old 06-30-2011, 11:13 AM   #44
 
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I'm 61, so not far.

It is amazing how some fish can "manage" in what is less than ideal conditions. I can't explain that. But my apoporoach is simple: provide an environment reasonably close to what the fish require, and chance are it will be healthier. We can't in most cases "see" what is going on internally, so why risk it.

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Old 07-01-2011, 09:28 AM   #45
 
It is amazing,the guppies thrived back then!

Do my new plants, the Brazil Pennyworth and Lutea need any kind of plant food and the Java Moss when I get it?
As to this algae bloom, is there anything else I should be doing? The params remain very stable. So want clear water to see my pretty pets better! Should I shorten the light on time or not good for the plants? Right now I am doing 10 hours on a timer. Only light I can get is GLO series 20 watt. Feed every other day and what they eat in 1-2 mins. no more. Have the tank now protected from AM sun. Tank is on west wall, with north windows about 8-9 feet away with TV blocking some of the window ambient light. Running a sponge filter (do as Bryon said and rinse every 2 weeks) and a 50 Aquaclear installed 8 days ago with a piece of my original sponge put in it too.

If I am doing anything worng please tell me, ANY suggestions will be appreciated. No other other place for the tank, and anyway it would be in rooms full of windows!

gupgram

Last edited by gupgram; 07-01-2011 at 09:30 AM.. Reason: spelling error
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Old 07-01-2011, 11:49 AM   #46
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gupgram View Post
It is amazing,the guppies thrived back then!

Do my new plants, the Brazil Pennyworth and Lutea need any kind of plant food and the Java Moss when I get it?
As to this algae bloom, is there anything else I should be doing? The params remain very stable. So want clear water to see my pretty pets better! Should I shorten the light on time or not good for the plants? Right now I am doing 10 hours on a timer. Only light I can get is GLO series 20 watt. Feed every other day and what they eat in 1-2 mins. no more. Have the tank now protected from AM sun. Tank is on west wall, with north windows about 8-9 feet away with TV blocking some of the window ambient light. Running a sponge filter (do as Bryon said and rinse every 2 weeks) and a 50 Aquaclear installed 8 days ago with a piece of my original sponge put in it too.

If I am doing anything worng please tell me, ANY suggestions will be appreciated. No other other place for the tank, and anyway it would be in rooms full of windows!

gupgram
Plant fertilization depends upon the aquarium. Nutrients occur in tap water (brought in with each water change), and from organics. If the plants are growing [which means, remaining alive, no decaying leaves] after a few weeks, they may be getting all they need. If not, a liquid fert like Seachem's Flourish Comprehensive dosed once a week will be sufficient.

You can reduce tank light down to 6 hours, so you have room to go yet if you have 10 now. As long as algae is not increasing uncontrollably, the light is fine.
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Old 07-07-2011, 11:02 PM   #47
 
UV Sterilizer...

Hi there,

Been ever so hectic with bringing my Mom home from re-hab with me to care for her, so apologize for the delay in answering!

My params remained so consistant. 0. incl. Phos. The plants, a few leaves I had to pinch off as they were turning yellow and found a little of like slimy roots that were not buried all the way. I did not find this until I did a 6 gal. water change then I bought an AA Green Killing Machine for $40. I read all the reviews I could find. I really think I have to much ambient light from the windows and lights are always on in this room and now my Mom has to have her table with a bright light right at the end of the tank. The water is clearing up very well. I got it on July 4th. Day after I got it, a Mama had her babies finally. For the longest time they just did not drop the babies. They have their own 2 gallon tank with a colonized sponge and doing very well. I will cull them out as soon as I know wht they look like.

I have kept the spong filter running as well as the Aqua Clear until the algae is gone. I understand I am to change the water 3-5 days after installing the UVS. I will tomorrow, change out 5 gal. Plants are now looking so good and so nice to see the fish and plants! They are so active! Oh one male is so well aggressive to the females. He drove one female twice into the rocks and injured her eye...now she has what I found...popeye! She is eating and acing fine! But again, If I need to change or do something different please tell me. Thank you in advandce! Gupgram

I will keep you all up to date.
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Old 07-14-2011, 05:27 PM   #48
 
Unhappy Fin Rot or what?

My water even though it went through an algae bloom, I put on a UV steralizer and in 5 days did a 5 gal change, cleaned the little blue sponge as instructed on the UV, the water is clear and through this all the params stayed 0!! But one of my pretty male gup's his tail started to look ragged (it was like a long flowing kind of rounded) at the top and in about 3 weeks about half gone. I finally caught one of the males nipping it. Now today, he is sluggish, the very ends of the ragged eges look kind of transparent not holes though. He seems to maybe loosing a little of his body color. I am setting up a gal. hospital tank with a good colonized sponge, that API Marine salt at 1 tsp. salt to a gallon is a good first step an up the temp. to 80 degrees. Right now I have him in a breeder tank in the main tank as the water warms (also with Aqua Safe plus and a llittle Nurtrfin in it the hosptial tank) and he is just swimming gently around then will just hang at the top. His fins seem a little clamped. No other signs in the other fish of fin rot or sickness.

Is there anything else I should do please? I am unsure of antibiotics. Will the antibiotics hurt my good sponge forever? Do I also do water changes to and if so how often?

Thank you in advance for any advice. Gupgram.
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:03 PM   #49
 
OOPS! I mean I added 1/2 tsp. of API salt not a tesp. He semms to like his new hospital tank. The sponge was to big but I did squeeze it a little to get nutrients from it. He is picking away at it on the bootom. Swimming with more energy. I took the air hose from the sponge and put it into the gallon jug and have it bubbling away in it. He swims to the top a little but mostly is exploring the bottom and all around. I sure hope this helps him!
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:21 PM   #50
 
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I've very little experience with disease issues, but it sounds to me that you're on the right track. Good luck.
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