cichlids and angelfish - Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources
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post #1 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 05:05 PM Thread Starter
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cichlids and angelfish

55 gallon: Would it be OK to have 2 parrot cichlids and 2 angelfish and some cory catfish in the 55 gal? I have read that keeping the angelfish and cichlids isn't the best idea but would these work?
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post #2 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 05:11 PM
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55 gallon: Would it be OK to have 2 parrot cichlids and 2 angelfish and some cory catfish in the 55 gal? I have read that keeping the angelfish and cichlids isn't the best idea but would these work?
No, there are two problems here. One is the "two" angelfish--I just finished explaining this in your other thread so won't repeat here. But angelfish should not be combined with blood parrot cichlids, as it explains in our profile of the latter:
http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/c...t=blood+parrot

I don't know if the BP might take to eating (or attempting) the corys... all I can say is that BP will eat small fish. As the cory profiles all indicate, the fish if swallowed can kill the predator via the erected spines which are toxic as well as sharp.

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Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

Last edited by Byron; 06-19-2013 at 08:13 PM. Reason: correct spelling
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post #3 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 05:46 PM Thread Starter
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Is there any type of cichlids that would be able to live with Angelfish?
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post #4 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 08:20 PM
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Is there any type of cichlids that would be able to live with Angelfish?
Yes, in certain situations. Generally speaking, and other than for rift lake cichlids, a cichlid species is best as the sole cichlid, combined with suitable "dither" fish. Angelfish are of course cichlids, so unless the space is very large, other cichlids are not always welcomed. In a 55g, a suitable group of 5 angelfish is going to fill the space and you wouldn't want other cichlids anyway. And in a case where some specific turn of events leaves one with a sole angelfish, I would provide non-cichlid tankmates rather than risking trouble.

Byron.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #5 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 08:22 PM
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You might be able to keep rams with them.. I've seen in done before, but I don't know how large the tank was. I would assume it would need to be a pretty long tank with a lot of plants and driftwood to claim their territory. The bolvian rams, I think, are more peaceful than the blue rams.. And they're also easier to care for and don't require as high of a temp as the rams (although the angels would be fine at the 80+ that the blue rams need.

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I think this should be ok, though probably risky if either are spawning.

+ Planted 75 Gallon Amazonian Tank +

Cardinal Tetras -- Rosy Tetras
Ember Tetras -- Silver Hatchetfish
Diptail Pencilfish -- Cories
Bristlenose Pleco
Lyretail Checkerboard Cichlids
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post #6 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 08:33 PM
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You might be able to keep rams with them.. I've seen in done before, but I don't know how large the tank was. I would assume it would need to be a pretty long tank with a lot of plants and driftwood to claim their territory. The bolvian rams, I think, are more peaceful than the blue rams.. And they're also easier to care for and don't require as high of a temp as the rams (although the angels would be fine at the 80+ that the blue rams need.

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I think this should be ok, though probably risky if either are spawning.
Yes, I would agree, and this is basically what I had in mind when I used the phrase certain situations.

I know its easy to think of this vast space (a 55g) in front of one, and these five small angelfish in there, and what could possibly be risky about this tiny little Bolivian Ram who has plenty of space... but of course this is now, not down the road when all these small fish are getting mature and begin to behave as nature programmed into them. And generally speaking, cichlids do not like other cichlids; most can't even tolerate their own species all that well.

My Bolivian male killed the female I put in with him, and that was in a 5-foot tank well planted. They didn't bond, and even after spawning 4 times he obviously considered her to be intruding into his personal domain, and he got rid of her. We may forget that in their natural habitat, Bolivians appear to live in isolation, only connecting when selecting their mate.
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Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]

Last edited by Byron; 06-19-2013 at 08:35 PM.
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post #7 of 9 Old 06-19-2013, 10:10 PM
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What you should be thinking is what is the end result you are looking for, and if it's reasonably attainable what are the steps needed to get your aquarium to that point. For two angels with little the chance of mayhem between the two it means a pair. Start with 6, and deal with a shop that understands that you will be returning a few considerably larger angels when you get a pair.

With other cichlids with angels there are plenty of dwarf cichlid species beyond rams, lots of apisto species, kribs, which are an African riverine dwarf cichlid, keyhole cichlids are a smaller more peaceful species that could possibly work with angels, there's a pretty big list. Angels are cichlids, the name is really deceiving, any time you're dealing with cichlids it's very wise to have a backup plan. At the very least have a divider handy, a better idea beyond that is a spare tank such as a 20 high, spare heater, filter that you can toss some media from the 55 into & so on.

As far as NW cichlids & aggression as a whole, you'll get some fish within a specific species that are really mellow, some within the same species that are just murderous asshats, seemingly can't cohabitate with anything, in the tank and at times directly outside the tank. Often it takes a bit of fish switchery to make a cichlid tank work, the biggest thing is knowing this up front, having a backup plan ready, and at times thinking a bit outside the box to make the tank you see in your mind's eye work.
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post #8 of 9 Old 06-20-2013, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by jennesque View Post
You might be able to keep rams with them.. I've seen in done before, but I don't know how large the tank was. I would assume it would need to be a pretty long tank with a lot of plants and driftwood to claim their territory. The bolvian rams, I think, are more peaceful than the blue rams.. And they're also easier to care for and don't require as high of a temp as the rams (although the angels would be fine at the 80+ that the blue rams need.

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I think this should be ok, though probably risky if either are spawning.
I agree with you, though in my experience the bolivians are just a wee bit more aggressive than the german rams. Still relatively not aggressive. A 4 foot tank ought to be enough room for the other fish to get away from the area, and of course you do not HAVE to let the fry grow up. You just have to be smart about how the tank is decorated, so that the eggs aren't laid right in the middle of the tank.



And I agree with Tolak 100%. While there are some cichlid species that do best as the only cichlid, there are many that can be kept together. You just have to be smart about it, and like Tolak said sometimes you may have to swap out a fish. A 55 gallon is certainly large enough for multiple cichlid species. However, a 55 is not large enough for blood parrots, in my opinion.

The problem most people have with keeping NW cichlids together is that they try in tanks that are just too small (or the fish are just too big), and/or they make poor choices in fish combinations.

125 - BGK, chanchito cichlid, pictus cats, silver dollars, palmas bichir
125 - cichlids (severums, bolivian rams, chocolate), rainbows ( turquoise, red), loaches (angelicus, zebra, kuhli and horseface), plecos (BN, RL and clown), denison barbs, tiretrack eel, pearl gouramis, betta
90 - Congo tetras, african knife, upside down cats, spotted ctenopoma, kribensis, delhezzi bichir
2.5 - betta

Last edited by jaysee; 06-20-2013 at 11:14 AM.
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post #9 of 9 Old 06-20-2013, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by truman View Post
Is there any type of cichlids that would be able to live with Angelfish?

Festivum cichlid,Keyhole cichlid,Bolivian ram,German blue ram, Severum, Rainbow cichlid, are a few I have kept with Angelfish without issues.

The most important medication in your fish medicine cabinet is.. Clean water.
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