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75 Gallon Amazon and 29 Gallon Community

This is a discussion on 75 Gallon Amazon and 29 Gallon Community within the Freshwater Journals forums, part of the Aquarium Photography category; --> I missed out a bit.. are these two males? The 75 is really too small for them? (sorry trying to catch up!)...

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75 Gallon Amazon and 29 Gallon Community
Old 08-13-2012, 03:27 PM   #21
 
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I missed out a bit.. are these two males? The 75 is really too small for them?
(sorry trying to catch up!)
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:48 PM   #22
 
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I missed out a bit.. are these two males? The 75 is really too small for them?
(sorry trying to catch up!)
Bolivian Rams are funny little things. Termie had 3, and he thinks they were all males, yes. One of them was being bullied by the other two, and unfortunately didn't make it, even though he moved him out of the tank. Once he was gone, the remaining two (that he's talking about) started to show aggression toward each-other.

With these guys. . . it can get tricky. I don't think it's SO much a matter of the size of the tank, but the aggression of the fish, which can depend on the individuals you end up with, and THEN the tank size might be an issue - if that makes sense. I'm a new Bolivian Ram keeper, too. I have FOUR of them in my 29g tank. I believe that I have 3 females and 1 male and I've never had a problem... but I'll be keeping a close eye on them - they're reaching maturity now, so I have backup plans in place should I come across any issues with aggression. I've read a LOT about these guys. . . they're funny about choosing their own mate, so many people get 6, find a pair, and re-home the others. From what I understand, Byron had a pair, who after living happily for some time, turned on each-other - he now only has one (I'd also like a picture )

I've been reading about them for months now, many people recommend keeping only a single Ram per tank, as according to a study they were found to be loners in the wild. Others have had great sucess with keeping a mated pair, and there are also those who feel that they do best in a tank as a group of 5 or 6+ I have no idea what the answer is, or how much of it is dependent on the fish's personality and/or tank environment - so I've been following Termie's tank (and my own!) with bated breath!
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Old 08-13-2012, 04:42 PM   #23
 
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These are old photos, the first is the male taken 3 yhears ago, and the second is the female I got for him shortly thereafter. They didn't bond though, and after 4 spawnings he did away with her just by hounding her continually. And this is a 5-foot tank and well planted.
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File Type: jpg M. altispinosus male.jpg (85.5 KB, 53 views)
File Type: jpg M. altispinosus female.jpg (89.0 KB, 54 views)
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Old 08-13-2012, 05:19 PM   #24
 
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Wow- I'm glad buffalos mate for life!

These guys sound harsh- getting a divorce after having hundreds of children? :O
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Old 08-13-2012, 05:27 PM   #25
 
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Heehee, yeah right? I've read that they often DO mate for life, but even within that bond, there can be bumps in the road, just as any couple would have. It's also not uncommon for a previously bonded pair to separate and choose new mates - you know how faulty information can be, I'm really looking forward to seeing this drama for myself, just praying that my little babies continue to be gentle :)

Thanks for the images, Byron! Really pretty fish. . . it's a shame that it didn't work out :( Your male is still living in the tank, though? Did you notice if his colors paled out once he was alone and not interested in mating?

I thought. . . that they wouldn't spawn unless they bonded, can you explain this further, please?
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Old 08-13-2012, 06:42 PM   #26
 
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These are old photos, the first is the male taken 3 yhears ago, and the second is the female I got for him shortly thereafter. They didn't bond though, and after 4 spawnings he did away with her just by hounding her continually. And this is a 5-foot tank and well planted.
Thanks for the pictures Byron!

Do you have any new pictures of your male?

How did you know she was a female?

Last edited by Termato; 08-13-2012 at 06:52 PM..
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Old 08-13-2012, 07:12 PM   #27
 
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Do you have any new pictures of your male?

How did you know she was a female?
Thanks, Termie! You KNOW I was dying to ask that - didn't want to hijack your thread any more than I already have!
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Old 08-13-2012, 07:51 PM   #28
 
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The bottom pic is named female.. Uhh the only difference I see is in the tail. :-p
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Old 08-13-2012, 08:08 PM   #29
 
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YES! But the top one is wearing a figleaf! ;) I've read a zillion methods of telling gender, but it seems like the only reliable difference is in the vent - very curious if Term's and my gender guesses are correct!
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Old 08-13-2012, 08:33 PM   #30
 
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Well, she laid eggs four times and they hatched, so...

But I was fairly certain. The male I bought four years ago next month, so he is nearing his life expectancy. I came across a tank of this species two years ago, and the fish were a bit larger than one often sees, so I stood in front of the tank for quite a time, observing the fish interactions. I spotted one and figured from the lack of caudal fin extensions that it was likely a female, and the way she was ignored by the males in the tank, who were continually threatening each other, that clinched it. So I brought her home. Within minutes of introducing her to the tank, the male began courting, and that satisfied me that she was female; if not the male who "owns" the tank would have made that very clear.

Within a few days they spawned on a flat rock. The eggs disappeared overnight, probably to the corys, whiptail cat or driftwood cats, all of which are nocturnal. A couple weeks later, another spawn, same place; these hatched but the fry disappeared on the second or third night. Two more spawnings followed, the fry of the fourth lasting several days before they disappeared overnight. The male became les and less tolerant of the female between successive spawnings, and sometimes even as she was guarding the fry. She soon took to hiding as much as she could, but she didn't last.

Last edited by Byron; 08-13-2012 at 08:35 PM..
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