Let's share our goldfish's diets
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Let's share our goldfish's diets

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Let's share our goldfish's diets
Old 06-14-2009, 05:33 AM   #1
 
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Let's share our goldfish's diets

What do you feed your goldfish? Since they're relatively versatile eaters, it's fun planning what to feed them. What's your staple feed, and what do you give them as treats?

As for me, I used to feed them generic pellets and flakes (unbranded stuff sold at the LFS), but I've switched to Hikari Wheatgerm pellets recently. I also used to feed them blanched leafy vegetables, but they lost their appetite for it, preferring to snack on the algae growing on the rocks and pond walls.

As treats, I feed them frozen blood worms once or twice a week. But I don't just dump the entire cube in the water, since it ends up all over the place. I had to clean bloodworms out of my filter and trust me, it isn't an enjoyable task. So what I do is let it thaw a little bit and hand-feed the fish. It's actually more rewarding since it provides the opportunity for a fishkeeper to interact up close with fish. Plus, it keeps the water clean. Other natural "treats" my fish get are the bugs that sometimes fall into the water and earthworms that get washed in by rain. I was worried at first about these but I realized that there's no stopping it. Even if I remove it when I'm around, what about the times when I'm not? So, in order to be safe, I've cautioned everybody not to use insecticide in the vicinity of the garden.
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Old 06-15-2009, 02:55 AM   #2
 
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Adiumroot, where do you get Hikari Lionhead, Hikari Oranda Gold and Saki-Hikari? I have been looking for these desperately especially the former to accelerate slightly the wen growth of my black and, red and white orandas despite the fact, protein based foods would help either way.lol The first one is sinking and would quickly get my vote any day. Still looking for the Dainichi and Mazuri although feedingfrenzy told me he will calculate the costs of importing Mazuri for me. Dainichi foods were cichlid specific so I cannot use those until he gets the goldfish based ones.

At the moment, I'm still waiting for the US premium sinking goldfish pellets to be shipped to me by feedingfrenzy. It has the right guaranteed analysis and ingredients for the goldfish although at half pound, it'll cost me an equivalent of $10.

I feed my goldfish right now with frozen bloodworms, floating pellets by Aquamaster for growth, and freeze dried shrimps by Sanyu. I am really picky with what I choose for my goldfish. I am trying to avoid a majority of goldfish foods which are in floating form although from my intensive researches so far, floating foods may not be the primary issue with most swim bladder disorder issues. The floating pellets I use eventually sink anyway unlike most other foods such as Hikari Bio Gold. I have been giving my goldies 3-4 small feedings in a day with what I have right now along with 2-3 times of water changes in a week by 40-50%. They eat the occasional algae that grow on rocks but the nerites seem to hog everything. Will let them try snail jello and gel foods by Mazuri (if I can locate this) soon. There seems noticeable growth for my watonai, fantail, some ryukins and orandas from this regimen.

Last edited by Lupin; 06-15-2009 at 02:58 AM..
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Old 06-15-2009, 10:22 AM   #3
 
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It's my first time buying Hikari. I bought it at Bio Research (As much as we hate that store, they are Hikari's official importer in the Phils.) when I was at the mall with the parents. I also saw H. Lionhead on stock. When I use up the 100 gram bag I bought, I might buy at Sam's Lagoon if it's cheaper. I'll give you a heads-up if I see Hikari for cheap here. By the way, Hikari Lionhead costs 160 pesos for 100 grams at Bio Research. I'll be using that as benchmark price.

Aren't Hikari Oranda and Hikari Lionhead the same, except that the former is floating while the latter is sinking? I'm not sure about the formulations but according to their website, their purpose is the same.

At first I was also wary of floating foods creating swim bladder disease, but reading around shows that floating food might not be the cause. Especially in my case where I take care of non-fancy goldfish. But for fancies, I think I'll stick to sinking. (I'm planning to get some orandas and ranchus when I get a large enough tank. Both money and space are a problem, though. LOL)

You're right, $10 is a lot when you convert it to our currency. That's why I don't like buying overseas. Though sometimes, there's no choice but to do so.

Last edited by adiumroot; 06-15-2009 at 10:24 AM..
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Old 06-15-2009, 05:44 PM   #4
 
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Adiumroot, I really need that Hikari Lionhead badly. LBC cost at least Php 140 for overnight priority shipping. I can pay you the overall expenses via BPI (BDO charges extra 100 now ). Do you still have my contact number? I'll PM you again just in case!
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Old 06-15-2009, 05:50 PM   #5
 
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Hikari Lionhead
Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein.......46%
Crude Fat.............6%
Crude Fiber...........5%
Moisture.............10%
Crude Ash...........12%



Features
  1. Specially formulated ingredients, including a higher level of necessary amino acids promote superior growth and desirable, true lionhead form.
  2. Using Hikari Lionhead eliminates the parasite and bacteria problems normally associated with feeding live foods and gives your pet their best chance of a healthy, long life free of infections or disease caused by these pests.
  3. Bio-Technology allows us to provide a diet that helps develop coloration not expected in goldfish raised indoors due to lack of natural UV. This technology also helps prevent fading of your pet's colors over time.
  4. High in stabilized vitamin C, Hikari Lionhead helps reduce stress and promotes immunity to infectious disease.
  5. A sinking pellet that will not dissolve and therefore does not cloud your water.
Hikari Oranda Gold


Features
  1. The specially formulated ingredients provide marvelous growth and promote desirable, true lionhead development normally not possible without feeding live foods while eliminating the parasite and bacteria problems normally associated with this type of feeding.
  2. Through Bio-Technology we offer you a diet that promotes coloration not normally expected in goldfish raised indoors due to an extreme lack of UV. This technology also helps prevent fading of your pet's color over time.
  3. High in stabilized vitamin C, Hikari Oranda Gold helps reduce stress and promotes immunity to infectious disease.
  4. A floating pellet which allows you to easily monitor and adjust the amount of food fed to avoid over-feeding and never clouds your water.
Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein.......45%
Crude Fat.............8%
Crude Fiber...........5%
Moisture.............10%
Crude Ash...........12%

I'd prefer the Hikari Lionhead in this case due to lower fat content although with more protein content to accelerate the wen growth which is perfect for my orandas!

Adiumroot, the swim bladder disorder is down to genetics I am pretty sure. Some goldfish seem to get floaty quickly when you try floating foods but some don't and none of mine have that issue. My ryukins are always on speed spurts crashing on anyone as they rush towards the foods. They seem to have grown noticeably since I got them and their tails are similar to butterflies. One has the jagged edges which makes it more stunning than the standard ryukin. I'll post new pics soon enough.

Last edited by Lupin; 06-15-2009 at 05:53 PM..
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Old 06-16-2009, 02:08 AM   #6
 
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Been researching immensely on the goldfish diet. See this one.
Food for Thought - Choosing the Best Koi and Goldfish Foods for Your Money

More.
Goldfish and Aquarium Board Article-Goldfish Nutrition Part 1: The natural diet and digestive processes.

Goldfish and Aquarium Board Article-Goldfish Nutrition, Part 2: Food and Nutrition

You would think fancy goldfish are beginner fish as some idiots often think.
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Old 06-16-2009, 02:42 AM   #7
 
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Comparing Hikari Lionhead and Hikari Oranda Gold...

Protein:
60 to 80 percent protein for rapidly growing baby fish (under one inch)
40 to 60 percent protein for young fish and females that are developing eggs
30 to 40 percent protein for older fish on essentially maintenance diets

Both are suitable for young fish and breeding females.

Hikari Lionhead
Ingredients:
Shrimp meal, cuttlefish meal, wheat flour, brewers’ dried yeast, rice meal, spirulina, protease, vitamin A, vitamin D3, vitamin E, vitamin K3, vitamin B12, L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (stabilized vitamin C), magnesium carbonate, manganese sulphate, calcium iodate.

Reference:
Hikari Lionhead Fish Food - Live Food Alternative for Fancy Goldfish

Hikari Oranda Gold
Ingredients:
Shrimp meal, cuttlefish meal, wheat flour, brewers’ dried yeast, rice meal, protease, vitamin A, vitamin D3, vitamin E, vitamin K3, vitamin B12, L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (stabilized vitamin C), magnesium carbonate, manganese sulphate, calcium iodate.

Reference:
Hikari Oranda Gold Fish Food - A Color Enhancing Daily Diet for Fancy Goldfish

Hikari has been applauded for its intensive researches in conducting tests before manufacturing its products suitable for particular groups of fish.

I'm going to chop these parts to make it easier for others to understood important details.

Do goldfish actually have stomach?
No, they do not which is why they have been mentioned a few times as having "inefficient digestive system". What could have been a stomach after gall bladder, is followed by the intestines. Look over here for further details.

What is the importance of fiber in its diet?
Fiber helps flush out the wastes. As I understand it, humans need plenty of fiber to help excrete wastes that would otherwise be difficult to expel. The same can be said with goldfish. Do you wonder why most brands claim this helps to avoid pollution? The health of the goldfish appears to have been compensated in favor of the pollution reduction.
Quote:
Commercial fish foods typically are low in fiber to reduce the amount fish poop. That's great for reducing the amount of poop in the tank, but I'm not convinced it's great for the fish digestive system.
But with higher fiber content, it would mean bigger waste production. How can this be minimized?
Quote:
Because of the lack of a stomach, multiple small meals are better for goldfish because that is closer to how they would eat in a natural habitat. If you feed large meals, a lot comes out the back end only partially digested which makes keeping your water happy more difficult. Lots of undigested food provides plenty of food for the bacteria that break down debris in the tank. Those bacteria consume oxygen, and release ammonia increasing the bioload on the tank and ultimately raising nitrAte levels.
What are fillers and what is the issue with them for goldfish diet?
Food for Thought - Choosing the Best Koi and Goldfish Foods for Your Money
Quote:
Some koi and goldfish foods are packed with inexpensive fillers that add no true nutritional value. They add weight to the product without adding a lot of cost. They also add waste to the pond because corn and cereal fillers are not digested. They pass through the fish and come out the other end as waste which dirties the water and can cause cloudiness. Healthy, nutritious koi and goldfish food is mostly digested and leaves little to waste. For that reason, some of our customers prefer to purchase high quality koi foods for the sake of keeping a cleaner system. "Corn Gluten" is okay if listed as low as the third or fourth ingredient but watch out for other corn or cereal fillers such as corn meal or soybean meal. Something else to watch out for is when manufacturers list an ingredient twice so that it doesn't appear as the first ingredient on the list. For example, corn content may be listed as corn gluten and corn meal. Although there may be more corn content in the food than fish meal by splitting the corn content in half the fish meal will come first.
Goldfish and Aquarium Board Article-Goldfish Nutrition, Part 2: Food and Nutrition
Quote:
Soybean meal is often added as a protein source, however it has high levels of a certain type of starch that goldfish don't have the enzymes to digest. They do have bacteria in their intestine that can digest the starch, however that can result in gas production.
So what makes starch avoidable at all costs if there are bacteria that help digest it?
It has to be noted that by producing gases as a result of digested starch, the air remains intact in the swim bladder already compressed, in fancy goldfish's cases, due to the body shape. So in short, it doesn't necessarily mean floating foods are to blame for the disorder but rather the inclusion of starch in the food provided to the fish.
Quote:
Given that fancy goldfish are predisposed to bouyancy issues because their swim bladders are all squished up in their rounded bodies, feeding some types of starches typically contained in commercial pellets and flakes can result in gas in the digestive tract which can make staying upright more difficult.
Hmmm..I think I tried to covered most of the simple and important parts.
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Old 06-16-2009, 10:43 AM   #8
 
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Wow, that's a lot of info.

I'm currently using Hikari wheatgerm, which according to the articles posted, is more suitable for older fish. Makes me want to switch to Oranda or Lionhead. Hmm... Oh well, I'll switch once I use this bag up. Or I could mix them. There's nothing wrong with that, right? But then again, I don't think I'll be doing anything wrong to my fish if I don't switch to higher protein foods. It's not like they;ll suffer from protien deficiency or anything, right? They just won't grow as fast. But I'm not in a hurry. As long as they're healthy and greet me with gulping mouths everytime I approach them.

About the fiber content in their diet, what foods are high in fiber? I've read that bloodworms help in cleaning digestive tract. But does that = fiber? But isn't fiber usually associated with plant foods?

Last edited by adiumroot; 06-16-2009 at 10:46 AM..
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Old 06-16-2009, 06:35 PM   #9
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adiumroot View Post
Wow, that's a lot of info.

I'm currently using Hikari wheatgerm, which according to the articles posted, is more suitable for older fish. Makes me want to switch to Oranda or Lionhead. Hmm... Oh well, I'll switch once I use this bag up. Or I could mix them. There's nothing wrong with that, right? But then again, I don't think I'll be doing anything wrong to my fish if I don't switch to higher protein foods. It's not like they;ll suffer from protien deficiency or anything, right? They just won't grow as fast. But I'm not in a hurry. As long as they're healthy and greet me with gulping mouths everytime I approach them.

About the fiber content in their diet, what foods are high in fiber? I've read that bloodworms help in cleaning digestive tract. But does that = fiber? But isn't fiber usually associated with plant foods?
Nothing wrong with mixing different types of dried goods. With the crude protein content on the foods you are using, deficiency on protein will not happen. Either lionhead or oranda gold seems okay to me but I prefer the lionhead only because I am more assured of the total 80% nutritional value and then higher protein content for the wen and body growth. I wouldn't mind trying out oranda gold though.

My goldies are growing steadily since increasing feeding schedule and water changes as I did not want to take chances I might stunt them from once a day feeding which I found to be rather low for the young goldfish.

Bloodworms don't help flush out the wastes. Bloodworms are ridiculously high in protein and most proteins are not even digested thus, can clog the GI tract and cause bloat or constipation.

Fiber is associated with plants indeed. You could use the Egeria densa, duckweeds or any fast growing plants. Even veggies help but blanching them will reduce the vitamins in them.

I found this list so don't take my word for it. I have not tried everything on the list. Peas are your best bet by far.

• Bananas, 3 grams - medium 8" long
• Beans, 6-10 grams - baked beans, black beans, great northern beans, kidney beans, garbanzos, pinto beans, white beans
• Berries, 4-5 grams - blackberries, raspberries
• Bran Cereals, 5-10 grams - All-Bran, Bran Buds, 100% Bran, Raisin Bran
• Bread, 4-7 grams - 2 slices whole wheat, pumpernickel, seven-grain
• Broccoli, 4-5 grams
• Brussels Sprouts, 2 grams
• Carrots, 3-4 grams
• Dried Figs, 10 grams - 3 figs
• Fruit, 4 grams - medium apple, medium pear
• Green Beans, 2 grams - broad beans, pole beans, snap beans
• Greens, 4-6 grams - beet greens, collards, kale, spinach, turnip greens
• Lentils, 6 grams
• Lima Beans - 4-6 grams
• Peas, 7-9 grams - black-eyed peas, green peas
• Potatoes, 4-5 grams - medium baked Idaho or sweet potato
• Sweet Corn, 5 grams
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