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Raising Electric Blue Jack Dempseys

This is a discussion on Raising Electric Blue Jack Dempseys within the Cichlids forums, part of the Freshwater and Tropical Fish category; --> So sorry to hear of your fish loss! I need to ask since I don't see it in your posts, what are your ammonia, ...

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Raising Electric Blue Jack Dempseys
Old 02-02-2011, 10:32 AM   #11
 
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So sorry to hear of your fish loss! I need to ask since I don't see it in your posts, what are your ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels? How long has it been running, ie cycle and well established or did you make changes to cause a mini cycle. We are notorious as fish owners for cleaning our tanks and saying ooooh that looks nice now, and running off to the LFS to get more fish, forgetting that we just may have caused chaos. Did anything like that happen? Clean your filter? change the substrate?
Also did you rest the bag for min 45 minutes to an hour, and drbble in "little drinks" of tank water to acclimate them to the different PH of your tank's water? You should double the bag's volume over the 45 min, by slowly adding tank water...
Temp shock happens very fast, within hours, but ph shock happens over the next day or two. Ammonia makes them clamp their fins tight to their bodies.
Please let us know your perameters and if you don't have a liquid test kit, please try to get one, not the strips as they are not reliable. Good luck.
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Old 02-03-2011, 06:37 AM   #12
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakiebabie View Post
So sorry to hear of your fish loss! I need to ask since I don't see it in your posts, what are your ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels? How long has it been running, ie cycle and well established or did you make changes to cause a mini cycle. We are notorious as fish owners for cleaning our tanks and saying ooooh that looks nice now, and running off to the LFS to get more fish, forgetting that we just may have caused chaos. Did anything like that happen? Clean your filter? change the substrate?
Also did you rest the bag for min 45 minutes to an hour, and drbble in "little drinks" of tank water to acclimate them to the different PH of your tank's water? You should double the bag's volume over the 45 min, by slowly adding tank water...
Temp shock happens very fast, within hours, but ph shock happens over the next day or two. Ammonia makes them clamp their fins tight to their bodies.
Please let us know your perameters and if you don't have a liquid test kit, please try to get one, not the strips as they are not reliable. Good luck.
Ammonia, nitrite & nitrate levels are all good. The tank is 7 months old. Has only 1 neon tetra as a tank mate. (Did not want to put my last little neon into my other tank where it would meet its end). My ph is the same as the breeder. Transferred fish to tank over 6 hours (as per breeders intructions) plenty of airation. As of yesterday I'm giving daily doses of Primafix and Melafix. Also I have a liquid test kit. I still hold my breath before looking at the tank every afternoon after work but my last EBJD seems to be doing well.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:09 AM   #13
 
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[quote=paul83;578429]Ammonia, nitrite & nitrate levels are all good. The tank is 7 months old. Has only 1 neon tetra as a tank mate. (Did not want to put my last little neon into my other tank where it would meet its end). My ph is the same as the breeder. Transferred fish to tank over 6 hours (as per breeders intructions) plenty of airation. As of yesterday I'm giving daily doses of Primafix and Melafix. Also I have a liquid test kit. I still hold my breath before looking at the tank every afternoon after work but my last EBJD seems to be doing well.[/quot

Describe how fish were acclimated. Should not have taken six hours considering the breeder's water and your water is same.If fish were in bag for this long, ammonia would be produced quickly and could have weakened,killed the fish.
Same could happen in small bucket or tub if half the water was not dumped at one hour intervals and aquarium water added.
Suddenly placing three or four fish in small quarantine tank that previously only held one tetra, could also cause sudden ammonia spike which may have taken place unnoticed before daily water change you say you are performing (good thing).
Biological filter (good bacteria), develops in proportion to the numbers of fish ,fish waste, fish food available (the one tetra).Adding three or four significantly larger fish could have taxed the biological filter and ammonia or nitrites rose suddenly to levels that the filter could not process= dead fish.
Just my opinion.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:24 AM   #14
 
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I took fish out of tank before adding ebjd's. Put ebjd's from bag into bucket with foregone adding water slowly over 6 hours from aquarium and tap water (tap water is same ph 7.4). The only things I can think of are I added too much water at a different temperature or I had some genetically weak ebjd's that were going to die anyway.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:26 AM   #15
 
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Iphone auto correct airstone not foregone.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:38 AM   #16
 
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Still would not discount the possibility that biological filter could handle the addition of one fish,but not three or four to a tank that only held one tetra previously.Not enough bacteria for the increase in numbers,size of fish,waste produced,and or food uneaten.Would be equivalent of starting a new tank(cycling) with too many fish for filter to process.
Six gallons is a bit small for quarantine and smaller volumes of water can go south more quickly than larger body of water.

Last edited by 1077; 02-03-2011 at 07:40 AM..
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:00 AM   #17
 
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1077 !! So you are saying that when we add a larger number of fish to even a well established tank, it causes an increase in poop = ammonia etc, and the existing good bacteria can't handle the load... which is why a small tank reacts very quickly to that load and you get death. Ahhh!! In a larger volume for example my 75G, I can add 5-6 and not loose anyone because of the volume of good bacteria already present. I still have to watch my numbers and do my water changes but it is far less trauma to the dynamics in the water. Of course all this depends on the type and size of fish I'm adding to even a 75G, 2 goldfish would reek havoc on even a larger tank. So adding 3 small to a 6 G would be hard on the load. (I'm going to get yelled at for saying this but... If these fish are coming from a KNOWN breeder, and not a store(!), he would have been better to have put the expensive fish right into his larger tank and risk other issues.) I know hind site is 20/20 but we need to understand what we do and the effects of those actions. Am I on the right track? Thx
Is this what you are saying 1077?
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:40 AM   #18
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakiebabie View Post
1077 !! So you are saying that when we add a larger number of fish to even a well established tank, it causes an increase in poop = ammonia etc, and the existing good bacteria can't handle the load... which is why a small tank reacts very quickly to that load and you get death. Ahhh!! In a larger volume for example my 75G, I can add 5-6 and not loose anyone because of the volume of good bacteria already present. I still have to watch my numbers and do my water changes but it is far less trauma to the dynamics in the water. Of course all this depends on the type and size of fish I'm adding to even a 75G, 2 goldfish would reek havoc on even a larger tank. So adding 3 small to a 6 G would be hard on the load. (I'm going to get yelled at for saying this but... If these fish are coming from a KNOWN breeder, and not a store(!), he would have been better to have put the expensive fish right into his larger tank and risk other issues.) I know hind site is 20/20 but we need to understand what we do and the effects of those actions. Am I on the right track? Thx
Is this what you are saying 1077?
Yes you are close enough. If my established 75 gal tank housed say five or six tetra's then biological filter would be sufficient for the waste created by those five or six fish.If
I were to suddenly add another dozen tetra's at once,then bacteria would have to scramble to catch up with the new addition of fish (ammonia).In larger tanks,,this may or may not cause sudden ammonia spike due to the dilution capabilities of larger volume of water. Daily water change would still be a good idea until the bacteria caught up due to possibility of ammonia or nitrite spike occurring between test's .
Another analogy would be ..take a drop of food coloring, and drop it into a glass of water,then take another drop and drop it into a five gallon bucket. If you consider the drop of food coloring and how quickly the water turns in the glass of water,then observe that the water does not change nearly as fast or as noticeable in larger bucket,, you then have an idea as to what ammonia levels also do in smaller body of water as opposed to larger volume.(if you consider the food coloring as ammonia).
Bacteria will only develop in proportion to numbers of fish,fishwaste,fish food ,available. Is always wise to add fish slowly ,one or two at a time with week in between new additions.
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Old 02-05-2011, 11:26 AM   #19
 
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Originally Posted by 1077 View Post
Yes you are close enough. If my established 75 gal tank housed say five or six tetra's then biological filter would be sufficient for the waste created by those five or six fish.If
I were to suddenly add another dozen tetra's at once,then bacteria would have to scramble to catch up with the new addition of fish (ammonia).In larger tanks,,this may or may not cause sudden ammonia spike due to the dilution capabilities of larger volume of water. Daily water change would still be a good idea until the bacteria caught up due to possibility of ammonia or nitrite spike occurring between test's .
Another analogy would be ..take a drop of food coloring, and drop it into a glass of water,then take another drop and drop it into a five gallon bucket. If you consider the drop of food coloring and how quickly the water turns in the glass of water,then observe that the water does not change nearly as fast or as noticeable in larger bucket,, you then have an idea as to what ammonia levels also do in smaller body of water as opposed to larger volume.(if you consider the food coloring as ammonia).
Bacteria will only develop in proportion to numbers of fish,fishwaste,fish food ,available. Is always wise to add fish slowly ,one or two at a time with week in between new additions.
This is very good advice on adding one or two at a time in regards to any addition to an established tank.

I will even add to this by saying that if you plan on making any addition to any aquarium you should set up a quarantine tank using water from the tank that you are planning on using in that tank in regards to having some sort of quarantine area.

This quarantine tank should be set up away from other aquariums and fish room. Some diseases can be airborne and can be transferred from tank to tank in many ways. There was a Guppy Disease that affected many breeders quite a while back that was said to be airborn. It is best to take the precautions in protecting your exsisting set ups.

Even breeder tanks can have some sort of pathogens in their water in regards to parasites and possible diseases. I have seen diseases whipe out whole aquariums in this regard. So loosing one or two fish is not like whiping out a whole tank of inhabitants.

Set up some sort of filtration ahead of time from your established tank to be transfered to the quarantine tank. This will provide some beneficial bacteria in the quarantine tank. In other words be prepared for any new arrivals by having the ability to transfer some sort of filter (sponge would work) to the Quarantine Tank. And make appropriate water changes with the tank water from the tank that you are adding the new fish to eventually. As 1077 has mentioned only a few fish should be added and a tank of appropriate size should be the quarantine tank. With the one or two fish to be added.

Get yourself products such as another syphon hose, net, and filter that should be disinfected with each use of your quarantine tank DO NOT USE these in any of your established tanks. Some bacterial forms of disease such as Fish TB can be dangerous to even humans in this regard. USE Gloves in your aquariums to protect against infections and DO NOT ever use any oral means in starting syphoning in your tanks.

Monitor the water parametres involved in both tanks especially in the quarantine tank for ammonia. Feed very sparingly during the time period of quarantine. This will help in regards to Ammonia and Nitrite toxins.

Observations of stress such as clamped fins and other things can be signs of harmful disease that can spread rapidly throughout aquariums. Thusly you can have more issues than enough by directly adding fish to the aquarium. There are a few medications that you can use in moderation during this period of time for quarantining the fish. Tetra Parasite Guard and life Guard can be used at this time for "preventative" measures. Salt in moderation according to your areas water can also be a good disease preventative.

After quarantine time is over generally i take six weeks for my quarantine time, the aquarium and all products involved in that aquarium should be shut down and properly Bleached and then the process should be then done with any additions.

Last edited by fan4guppy; 02-05-2011 at 11:45 AM.. Reason: additions
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:52 AM   #20
 
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New Pic!!

New pic of my little EBJD!!
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