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Krib and Ram????

This is a discussion on Krib and Ram???? within the Cichlids forums, part of the Freshwater and Tropical Fish category; --> Well thanks very much for that insight. I haven't gotten any apistos yet, and I think I will wait to add them when i ...

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Old 01-09-2010, 12:11 PM   #31
 
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Well thanks very much for that insight. I haven't gotten any apistos yet, and I think I will wait to add them when i get another tank that I can put them in if all fails. I really dont want to put myself into a situation like that. I did get some plants. The LFS was low on plants due to boxing day, however they will be getting more next week. I got three "bunch" plants. One is a small-leaved purpleish plant, another is a very light (almost neon) green colour and another is tall skinny and has dark green roundish leaves. My tank looks so much better with plants. On my green plant, there are roots growing out halfway through the stems. I did an experiment: I cut off the end of a branch below the root and place the little fragment in the sand on the other end of my tank. It seem to be growing and doing fine, but its only been there for like two days... do you think the little lpant will survive and grow into another adult plant? Also for my new tank, that I might get, what do you think I can stock it with, that will be able to take in some apistos if they dont get al0ng in the 29. I wanted some skirt tetras or larger tetras but they need an established tank. I was thinking of a 40ish gallon tank. What is the size of tank closest to 40 (more or less doesnt matter). You guys are such a great help!
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Old 01-09-2010, 12:43 PM   #32
 
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Bunch plants, or stem plants as they are often called, grow by extending the "stem" toward the surface where the light is the strongest. Along the stem roots develop, on some species more than others. All stem plants can be cut at any point and the stems will continue to grow. Plant the cut end in the substrate and you have another plant on its way. The top part of the stems usually look nicer so most who have stem plants regularly pull them out and cut off the top portions (can be 12 inches or more, or less) and replant them. Stem plants grow quickly (good water filters) and tend to lose the lower leaves so this practice keeps them looking nice; some have to be trimmed like this every week.

Most of the Apistogramma are docile with other fish, and I have had pairs/trios of several species in tanks with almost any number of characin (tetras, pencilfish, hatchetfish), corydoras, etc. Having shoaling fish like the tetras works well as the apistogramma are not active in the swimming sense, they cruise around picking at food bits off the substrate, wood and plant leaves. One consideration in selecting tetras is temperature, it shuld suit the apistogramma. Some prefer warmer water, so cooler water tetras like neons would not be a good match.

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Old 01-09-2010, 05:44 PM   #33
 
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I was thinking, if I do get another tank, I could just get a large tank with cories, either apistos or rams, tetras. Obviously I would have to chose species that can coexist and like the same water parameters. I like larger tetras and I also like neon tetras. Any stocking ideas? I find if I added more cichlids to my 29g, it would be overcrowded.
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Old 01-09-2010, 05:58 PM   #34
 
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Anomalochromis thomasi

I have had one in my acidic soft water and my friends medium hard water like yours. Beautiful fish. It's worth taking a look into. ;)
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Old 01-10-2010, 08:22 PM   #35
 
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I looked at the thomasi and they are pretty cool. I saw african butterly fish at my LFS, I think those are A. thomasi. Right now, I am focused on getting ghost shrimp and snails for my 10 gallon because I only have two cories in thee and cories need large groups, so instead of getting more cories, I will send them off to my LFS and get shrimp and snails. I have a fake hornwort plant in my 29 gallon and it has tons of algae on it, there are also a lot of little algae growths on the glass, my ottos dont seem to clean those things. I heard shrimp do, but I dont know if they can survive in my 29gallon. For my new tank here is an idea I came up with:
40 Gallons
- 10 neon tetras
- 6 blackskirt tetras
- 3 german blue rams
- 6 cories
I dont know if they share water requirements, but due to the rams being there it has to be acidic and soft. I also wanted to include either dwarf gouramis or spotted climbing gouramis, however I dont know if they are compatible in my tank. I have kept a dwarf gourami before and it was gorgeous and it brought a lot of colour to my tank. So if there is any way to include a species of gourami, GBRs, a school of small schooling fish and ideally a cleaning crew (cories, ottos, etc.) I am going to leave my 29 gallon tank how it is. I originally wanted GBRs, but then I found out my tank couldnt support those fish. So I moved on to apistos and others. But now that I am thinking of setting up a whole new tank, GBRs are a possibility again (YAY!) Also if i do get a new tank, I was thinking of a fish-less cycle because i have used fish for cycling in the past and they always develop infections and die (it isnt fair or humane). Can I add plants to help cycle, what is the quickest and best way. I was also thinking of filling it with water from my other tanks during water changes and then adding rain water/snow to lower the pH. Would it make a difference with existing tank water? Thanks again everyone :)
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Old 01-10-2010, 08:58 PM   #36
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dylan94 View Post
I looked at the thomasi and they are pretty cool. I saw african butterly fish at my LFS, I think those are A. thomasi. Right now, I am focused on getting ghost shrimp and snails for my 10 gallon because I only have two cories in thee and cories need large groups, so instead of getting more cories, I will send them off to my LFS and get shrimp and snails. I have a fake hornwort plant in my 29 gallon and it has tons of algae on it, there are also a lot of little algae growths on the glass, my ottos dont seem to clean those things. I heard shrimp do, but I dont know if they can survive in my 29gallon. For my new tank here is an idea I came up with:
40 Gallons
- 10 neon tetras
- 6 blackskirt tetras
- 3 german blue rams
- 6 cories
I dont know if they share water requirements, but due to the rams being there it has to be acidic and soft. I also wanted to include either dwarf gouramis or spotted climbing gouramis, however I dont know if they are compatible in my tank. I have kept a dwarf gourami before and it was gorgeous and it brought a lot of colour to my tank. So if there is any way to include a species of gourami, GBRs, a school of small schooling fish and ideally a cleaning crew (cories, ottos, etc.) I am going to leave my 29 gallon tank how it is. I originally wanted GBRs, but then I found out my tank couldnt support those fish. So I moved on to apistos and others. But now that I am thinking of setting up a whole new tank, GBRs are a possibility again (YAY!) Also if i do get a new tank, I was thinking of a fish-less cycle because i have used fish for cycling in the past and they always develop infections and die (it isnt fair or humane). Can I add plants to help cycle, what is the quickest and best way. I was also thinking of filling it with water from my other tanks during water changes and then adding rain water/snow to lower the pH. Would it make a difference with existing tank water? Thanks again everyone :)
These or similar questions get asked so often I forget which I have and haven't responded on. But no matter, you asked for advice and that is why we're here, to help if we can.

Rams need warm water, neons do not, so right off that's an issue with your proposed stocking; cardinals would be a better choice in warm tanks. Also, some corys (C. sterbai is one) can withstand the 82F or higher the rams need, but most will not. I speak from experience; my heater malfunctioned one evening and the temp in the tank went to 84 or 85 and all the corys died within 2 days. So, while these fish would all appreciate (if not need) soft acidic water, the temp is problematical.

Planting a tank at the beginning allows you to add fish from the first day with no problems, provided the plants are sufficient to handle the fish load. There is basically no "cycling" period. I explain this in the section on "Nutrients" in Part Two of my 4-part series on natural aquaria stickied [if that's a word] at the top of the Aquarium Plants section of this forum.

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Old 01-11-2010, 10:04 AM   #37
 
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Is there a general rule as to how many plants per fish at the beginning? I am confused as to what to stock my new tank with... can you give me some ideas, I want to include either dwarf cichlids or angelfish. I had angelfish before but my kribs killed them. I dont know if a 40 or 45 gallon will be adequate housing for angelfish, apistos are still an option ( I love them still), I am starting to drift away from the idea of GBRs because they are really delicate and specific in water requirements. Thanks -Dylan
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:25 PM   #38
 
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A planted tank should have what you want, it is your tank after all. Sometimes this will depend upon what is available through stores, sometimes you may order plants online. I always begin by deciding what I want as the finished aquascape in terms of fish (primarily) and plants.

Angelfish would be fine in a 40g, they are social shoaling fish and three would work well. There are many tetra species that could go with this, and oif course Corydoras cats. Or you could look to the rasbora, and some of the smaller loaches. A trio of Apistogramma would also work, with any of the same fish as tankmates.

Sword plants are a good choice because they are hardy, will generally do well in slightly basic/alkaline water, and there are species usually available. The pygmy chain swords would make a good bottom cover. And some floating plants to provide security for the fish. In a 40g, if you planted say 3 of the larger swords like the common sword Echinodorus bleheri, with a single pygmy chain sword (they will send out runners with plantlets fast once they are settled so one to start with is sufficient), and something floating like Water Sprite (Ceratopteris) or a stem plant (they will float) as floating plants are generally fast growers and thus perfectly suited to new tanks. With angels Vallisneria make good plants, as their long ribbon-like leaves provide the ideal habitat for angels who occur in calm waters with vertical plant growth, roots, and branches with which they blend in; Valls also do very well in harder alkaline water.

With a planting like this in a 40g I would put in a shoal of tetras or rasbora (once the plants are in), then more (depending upon what you decide on), adding the Corydoras after a couple weeks, lastly the angels or dwarf cichlids after a couple more weeks when the tank has become basically settled biologically. The plants will easily handle the ammonia from the first fish, and adding the fish in stages will ensure success.

When you're deciding on tetras or rasbora, keep in mind the water parameters including temperature for the angels or cichlids, and choose accordingly. Also, angels will consider small tetras food, so species like neons do not usually fare well.

Byron.

Last edited by Byron; 01-11-2010 at 01:29 PM..
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:45 PM   #39
 
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Does this stocking list sound good? :
- 4 angelfish (pteraphyllum scalare)
- 6 corydora panda
- 2 peppered cories (from 10 gal)
- 8 blackskirt tetras
- 1 male dwarf gourami

I will include a lot of amazon sword plants and other broad leafed plants, java moss (if I can find some), stem plants, java ferns. I want to put a big piece of driftwood in the center and cover it with java moss and java ferns. I was thinking of sand as a substrate. My other two tanks have sand, and it is really easy to take care of. From what youve told me and what me research told me this is how I will go about setting up this tank:
1: I will fill the tank with water, sand, decoration, drift wood, rocks and of course, a lot of plants.
2: I will wait 2-3 days and then I will get a school of 8 blackskirt tetras.
3: I will wait a week or two until I know that the water is stable and suitable for adding more fish.
4: I will add 1 male dwarf gourami
5: I will wait a week.
6: I will add a shoal of panda cories
7: I will wait a week
8: I will, providing the tank parameters are stable and adequate for angelfish, add 4 juvenile angelfish.
9: I will spend hours in aw of my new fantastic tank
10: I will make any adjustments necessary for my little fishies to be happy :)

I have never kept shrimp before and I would love to include them in all of my tanks, will they be OK in the following tanks? (BTW either chery shrimp or ghost shrimp)

10 gal, many guppies, 1 male beta, 2 cories (that are soon to be moving into my new 40G... yay :)
29 gal, 13 kribs (soon to be 4), 7 albino tiger barbs, 3 swordtails, 3 otoclincus
40gal, 4 angelfish, 8 cories, 8 black skirt tetras, 1 male gourami

I am so excited for my new tank, thank you guys so much!!! (especially you byron :) )
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Old 01-11-2010, 03:08 PM   #40
 
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Sounds fine. All those waits may be over-reaction, but better safe than sorry when you're doing this for the first time; you learn from experience what does or doesn't work. Corydoras panda are particularly sensitive to water issues, so I would leave them to last; the C. paleatus (peppered) are Ok earlier.

I've no personal experience combining gourami with angels, and I think there have been posts recently that caution this, so I'll leave that for the experienced members with gourami/angels to comment. Same for the shrimp question; I would think angels would find shrimp excellent snacks...

A chunk of wood is excellent in this setup, make sure it is not centre tank, it looks artifical and contrived; set it slightly off centre and there you go.

I like your point #9. How true; sometimes I don't think aquarists spend enough time just sitting still in front of a tank. I have been known to do this for 2-3 hours; it is fascinating what you can see. Of course, it is as they say very relaxing, and I sometimes doze off...

Byron.
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