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Its' Brain picking time. Please help me get it right .

5K views 27 replies 6 participants last post by  Jaybird1 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Here are four pieces of driftwood I hope to purchase today, for my angle fish tank.
The tank is a standard 150 gallon rectangle with a black background; 60" X 24" x 24". Since the tank will not have an over flow box, the the tall pieces I plan to use to hide the filtration plumbing I plan to build inside the tank with clear PVC pipe. ( Not Glued )
While doing my research it was explained that the driftwood need to be soaked prior to placing in the tank for non-buoyancy and to leach out the tannins.

I read that it should be for a period of two weeks.

If this is all it takes, should I change out the water during the leaching period:?:
 
#2 ·
Yes change out the water when it gets dark. Those are probably too big but if you can fit them in a large pot (such as a lobster pot) boiling them will speed up the leaching process. As for how long is needed to get the wood to sink, it varies. After a couple weeks of soaking it may or may not sink all the way. I weighed my manzanita wood down using large rocks.

Those are some nice pieces by the way. Good luck and enjoy your 150!
 
#3 · (Edited)
This post was to be posted in the Cichlids threads

I guess I should mention that Pterophyllum scalare are the main theme.
Planting and Stocking question are soon to follow.

The picture A-7 was unavailable. The pieces are smaller than the pictures look. Only one would extend out of the tank if set up in the right direction. Otherwise a little trimming would not be out of order. I bought four pieces to see which ones work best. The tall ones will be used to hide the clear plastic pipes I plan to use to hook up to the canister filter I bought when I purchased my tank.

The tank I bought is a standard 150 gallon 60" X 24" X 24" without the over flow wall, it took up to much room. but I am having '2' - 1" bulkheads installed. Hence the extra need for plumbing in and under the tank.

I do have a large unused horse trough, about 4 feet long by 30 inches deep.

If boiling is needed I can get a new 30 gallon metal garbage container and use the propane burner used to fry the turkey.;-)

As I work to put my tank together, I plan to post more picture as I go. I hope I can make you all Part of this project.:smile:


Thanks for your input jeanine.
 
#5 ·
Lost Pictures



:question:Here are four pieces of driftwood I hope to purchase today, for my angle fish tank.
The tank is a standard 150 gallon rectangle with a black background; 60" X 24" x 24". Since the tank will not have an over flow box, the the tall pieces I plan to use to hide the filtration plumbing I plan to build inside the tank with clear PVC pipe. ( Not Glued )
While doing my research it was explained that the driftwood need to be soaked prior to placing in the tank for non-buoyancy and to leach out the tannins.

I read that it should be for a period of two weeks.

If this is all it takes, should I change out the water during the leaching period:?:
Since I bought the driftwood the site I linked the pictures to has since removed the pictures because they were sold.
I have received the tracking number this morning; they are due here next Wednesday the 25th. As soon as I take new pictures I'll post them.
 
#6 ·
Finally A Place to Start. " MOCK-UP # 1"



I am still waiting for my tank, but I received the driftwood I ordered. So while I wait, I decided to up load this picture and ask what you think.


The base the driftwood rest on is the size of the tank 60x24x24, the height of the tank is equal to the bottom edge of the black tv mount on the wall. If you can see it, in the right rear corner behind the wood is a PVC pipe 22 inches high representing wear the overflow is located.

The PVC fittings under the pieces of driftwood are, represents the aproximate grade level sloping from the left to the right from about 4 inches down to 2 inches. The piece in the center is centered in the middle and is 22"s X10"s front to back X 12 "s high. The one on the right is 9"s wide x7"s deep 21 high.
 
#9 · (Edited)
This brings me to my next question. Substrates?



Well I figure I'll be needing between 2 and 3 - 5 gallon buckets. Wish I knew how much one of these buckets weights? Like I said earlier, the left side is four inches going to the right and front it will slope down to around 2 to 2.5 inches. From what I have read, the substrate max size should be around 1/8th inch. The substrate in the picture has a granular size: 1/16th to 1/8 inch, and it is not supposed to break down.

The scene I am trying to create is a small Amazon tributary after the rainy season and the flood waters have begun to slow and the fish are just returning and just being fish.:oops: I am not looking to breed fish, I never was, but nature has its' way.;-)

My question is; should I mix in a small amount of larger gravel, say about 3/16ths to 1/4 of an inch; or just use all Amazon Red to plant my plants? After all I am a firm believer in "KISS".

Here are a few bottom feeders I am looking at: Queen Arabesque Plecos ,
Starlight Bristlenose Pleco, Leopard Pleco.
 
#10 ·
The Queen Arabesque Pleco reminds me of a toned down Imperial Zebra Pleco. They have two problems, they stay very tiny (may not be a problem for you, so long as you don't get too many predators), and are very expensive.
 
#11 ·
Plecos' and Caves and River Bottoms? Oh what To Do?


Thanks for the advice. I am looking though, to get fish that are less aggressive to other fish. I want a happy tank.:lol:


From my research looking into S.A. Angelfish river habitats, the river bottoms seem mostly a reddish brown sandy bottom with tree roots, and lacking in natural rocks.

If I am wrong please tell me.

The past few days I have been thinking on ways to meet the cave requirements for Plecos' and other catfish. Rocks are a natural way to build caves. So I've been looking for rocks and think I found an appropriate color rock.


It makes sense to me to use rocks around the pieces of driftwood, because when roots and stumps flow down a flooded stream they would get entangled with the rocks slowing down the current letting sand build up over the rocks forming sand bars. In real life eddies would form and cut out the softer sand making caves. But, like I said the past few days I've been thinking about this; and I think I have a theory on how not to use rocks.

So what do you think if I took say a piece of 4 inch PVC pipe cut it to say a 6 inch long piece. Then cut it long ways diagonally ending up with two halfs. I then could bury them behind the arches formed by the thicker roots and cover them over with the substrate.
 
#14 · (Edited)
Today it finally arrived

Today was a big receiving day; not only did I get my new 150 gallon 60x24x24 fish tank with stand and canopy, and necessary equipment. The substrate also arrived plus a few other things. :lol:

New pictures to follow.

I got a lot of plumbing to do.

By the way the driftwood has been under water now for two days.

So just how many fish can you fit in a 150 gallon tank?
 
#15 ·
The answer to that is a lot of fricken fish. What kind of fish you thinking of putting in there? Cichlids? Aggressive/semi-aggressive? Or a huge community of small fish??
 
#16 ·
Working fish list so far.



First off, in a perfect fish world I am looking for a Happy Fish Community. That said, I do realize nothing is perfect.

The tank is themed South American Cichlids, though not all fish are from S.America.

Main fish will be Anglefish Scalare

I also was concidering Congo Tetra, Diamond tetra Queens Arabesque Pleco and a couple of Starlight Bristlenose Pleco.

I am open for suggestions. I do not want to over crowd the tank I want room for the fish to grow.

Has anyone ever used aquariumplants.com? They do Aqua Scapes designs besides selling you all kinds of plants and accessories. For me they are only an hour an a half away. With preapproved permission they will let me pick up my plants at their warehouse. They just moved from the upper mid west to just outside of Tampa Florida.
 
#17 ·
If you want your angelfish to do well, you should not put any kind of tetra in with them. The truth about tetras is they are vicious fish. No wonder that is what a pirhana is. Anyway, I have made the mistake of putting tetras with angels before, and I ended up with some severely damaged fins, and the angels were never able to recover. With congos being so large, this amplifies the amount of damage they can do. The other problem is that angels prefer very slow moving water. This will help with plants, however if you put American Cichlids in the tank, or any cichlid for that matter (I know an angelfish is a cichlid, but they are they exception), they seem to prefer faster moving water, or at least areas of high current, and will uproot your plants the first chance they get.
 
#18 ·
Btw, my 150gal planted is stocked as follows:
2 Ornate Bichirs
Pink Tailed Chalceus
Archerfish
Electric Blue Acara
6 Giant Danios
6 Congo Tetras
11 Buenos Aires Tetras
6 Rosy Barbs
6 Black Ruby Barbs
Bristlenose Pleco
3 or 4 Green Corys
X # of Feeder Guppies
X # of Ghost Shrimp
3 Mystery Snails
2 Horned Nerite Snails

Try typing that into aquadvisor...
Really the only thing it says is the Bichirs will eat everything else...
 
#19 ·
OK but Tim's Tropical Freshwater Compatibility first search on Anglefish says:
Black Skirt Tetra, Blind Cave Tetra,
Chinese Algae Eater, Congo Tetra,
Corydoras Catfish, Diamond Tetra,
Gouramis, Kuhli Loach, Lemon Tetra,
Mollies, Platies, Plecostomus,
Rainbows, Serpae Tetra,
Silver Dollars, Silver Tip Tetra,
Swordtail

Guppies, Neon Tetras and White Clouds are eaten by Angelfish.
They often hunt smaller fish at night.

50% of our readers indicate that Discus are compatible with Angelfish
Boy would I like to have both Discus and Anglefish
I believe that the water Parameters would be to far apart, as I remember the water temp. for the discus is to high for other compatible fish.

Then I went to the next compatibility chart, and got a completely different answer.

Search Results:
The Angelfish should be kept in groups of 4
and is compatible with the Altum Angelfish,
Bala Shark, Black Skirt Tetra, Blind Cave Tetra,

Blood Parrot Cichlid, Chinese High Fin,
Chocolate Zebra Pleco L270, Congo Tetra,
Corydoras Catfish, Diamond Tetra, Dwarf Gourami,
Flash Pleco L204, Gardneri Killifish,
Giant Gourami, Glass Fish, Honey Gourami,
King Tiger Pleco L066, Kissing Gourami,
Lemon Spotted Green Pleco L200, Leopard Pleco L114,
Molly, Pearl Gourami, Peppermint Pleco L030,
Queen Arabesque Pleco L260, Serpae Tetra,
Silver Dollar, Silver Hatchetfish, Silver Tip Tetra,
Starlight Bristlenose Pleco L183, Sunshine Pleco L014,
Three Spot Gourami, Zebra Pleco L046,
When I introduced myself I said parphrasing;


So here is my story. While in my mid 20's, I started my first 30 gallon freshwater tank. I stocked the tank with the standard Zebras, Neon terras, Kissing gouramis, etc. By the time I got married in my mid 30's; I had grown to a 55 gallon tall tank. Still had my Kissing gouramis's I had gotten an Angel fish, silver with a black stripe by its' dorsal fin, I was told it was called a Black Veil. It grew to about the size of a silver dollar, the feelers would reach the gravel while it was swimming about the mid level of the tank, a beautiful fish it was.. Moving along by the time I reached my 40's, and a major job change, I had move my tanks, fish and the water no less then 5 times.
I had the system down pat, One day I walked into the room I had the tank in I was floored to see that one of the front corners was leaking. I twas time to take a break.
:thankyou:
So here is the true problem I need help with.

So many fish to choose from, how many do I really need, who is going to eat who?:dunno:
 
#20 ·
Why not just get a dozen angels?
It is black skirt tetras are a more tempered variety, they typically just fight amongst themselves. Buenos Aires, Serpaes, Congos, and lemons (though they usually lose) are quite aggressive, and are classified as fin nippers.
Actually, I do kind of like my idea of loading it up with a bunch of angels. My LFS sells quarter sized angels for ~$3. A dozen of those, or more, and you can grow them out nicely. Getting them that small, and keeping them in a deep tank, Wil likely prevent their dorsal fin from collapsing. I'm sure you've seen them where their fin goes up, and then straight back. That results from keeping the fish in too shallow of a tank.
 
#21 ·
Spent the day working on a new list


Assorted Angelfish - Medium

Angelfish - Pinoy Blue Zebra - Medium
Angelfish - Fire Koi - Medium
Angelfish - Half Black SuperVeil Lace Leopards - Medium

Corydoras Catfish >6+:
2 Corydoras Ambiacus,
2 Corydoras leopardus,
2
Corydoras Ornatus,
2 Corydoras Sterbai

Pearl Gourami GROUPS 4

Three Spot Gourami >Female & <males = 3 over 1 for 4 total
***********************************************

So here is the list. All the fish listed should make for a Happy Tank.:smile:
I do not want to breed fish, but there is no guarantees.

Question is how many catfish should I put in a 150 gallon tank out of the list?

Why not just get a dozen angels?

Actually, I do kind of like my idea of loading it up with a bunch of angels. My LFS sells quarter sized angels for ~$3.
I have been giving that a lot of thought, but I also feel it might get a bit boring if I do not put something else in the tank like 4 of each of the gouramis listed. Though I like the Pearl gouramis more then the three spot gourami; I would cut the three spot for the extra room.

The Half Black SuperVeil Lace Leopards is a must. I like the Pinoy Blue Zebra, but I want more of a blend of colors. Like the Fire Koi is ok, or should I just get assorted angles?

I suppose, I would if it would not be to many; get as many as 20 angles.
 
#22 ·
I would pick your favorite two corys, and get 4 of each. Even though they are a similar fish, they will not shoal together because they are not the same. Kind of like picking two different kinds of tetras and putting them together. Realistically, you could probably put 6 of two different kinds and be fine.

Angels when they are growing healthily and have plenty of room without any aggressors, are not boring. They can be very active and entertaining, just like any other cichlid. Gouramis, while not aggressive towards other fish, can be aggressive towards each other.
 
#23 ·
Three veiws of my mock-up





If you look carefully at the front view the driftwood is raised up on PCV fittings. The driftwood ( the largest piece) all the way to the right and at the bottom of the overhead is almost 4 inches off the base maximun depth of sustrate. It also reaches to the front middle center of the tank. The substrate where the tip reaches is only 2 inches max. The massive parts of the driftwood are center down the middle.

What I want to create is a cross view of a seasonal flooded plain flowing left to right after the floods have past and the water has return to a slow to moderate rate looking from the middle of the river towards the shore. Sand (substrate) would have built up behind the driftwood creating small sand bars and caves under the arches in the driftwood for the cat's. The front 6 inches wolud be very short plants or no plants mixed leaving bare sandy areas. That should give the angles plenty of swimming room.

I would pick your favorite two corys, and get 4 of each. Even though they are a similar fish, they will not shoal together because they are not the same. Kind of like picking two different kinds of tetras and putting them together. Realistically, you could probably put 6 of two different kinds and be fine.

Angels when they are growing healthily and have plenty of room without any aggressors, are not boring. They can be very active and entertaining, just like any other cichlid. Gouramis, while not aggressive towards other fish, can be aggressive towards each other.
I could live with 4 Corydoras Ambiacus, and 4 Corydoras Ornatus, and do without the Gouramis.

So the question that remains is just how many Angelfish?


 
#24 ·
This is a 5 foot 150 gallon, correct? I would do 8-9 angels and a total of 12-14 cories. In the wild cories are found in huge schools. I would not do more than 2 kinds. So pick 2 that you like and do a large school of each. They will be much more active, much happier and you will see some interesting behavior from them when the are in a large group. Looking forward to watching this tank progress.
 
#25 · (Edited)
0000h! Its' a lot of fish!




Yes this is a 60" X 24" x 24" 150 gallon tank.
I could even live with 6 Corydoras Ambiacus, and 6 Corydoras Ornatus, and do without any Gouramis.

The thing is the tanks main fish is supposed to be Angelfish.The reason for the 24 tall. I have to stand on a ladder to rich the bottom back of the tank.

I have specific Angels in mind:

Angelfish - Half Black SuperVeil Lace Leopards - Medium
Angelfish - Pinoy Blue Zebra - Medium
Angelfish - Fire Koi - Medium
and maybe
Angelfish - Pinoy Green Veil Lace- Medium

If I get 4 of each that would be 16; then if there is room maybe get an assorted bunch of 5 making the total 21 Angels and 12 Cories making the total population 33.
 
#26 ·
Hmmm...I think 21 angels is a lot in a 5 foot tank unless you plan to rehome some as they grow. But definitely too many at adult size. Was that you're plan?
 
#27 · (Edited)
Thats been my main problem



I've been asking just how many fish should I get? This is my last chance to build my dream tank. I want to get it right. It is why I joined this forum, to pick any and every mind that would help. I never had such a large tank before. You know what they say.:hmm: If you are going to do it , you might as well go all in, or think big or stay home.:BIGgrin:

The rest of the plumbing materials arrive this afternoon. My sister in law came down this month to vist friends in Port Richey Florida, and I have to pick her up on Wendenday for a weeks stay. Hopefully by the time she leaves my 1" bulkheads that were left out of the shipment will have arrived. Then if my back no longer hurts I can get down into the stand to plumb the system together. :whip:
 
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