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finaly gonna start my new tank

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finaly gonna start my new tank
Old 01-27-2010, 08:10 AM   #11
 
A one inch bed mightl cause you issues in the long run. Just get a 20 pound bag and use it, thats probably the minimum you will find at petco anyway. You want aragonite sand, with that tiny a tank you want every advantage you can get because realistically, as a new saltwater guy, you are fighting a steep learning curve as it is.

With the LR, its easy to go cheap if you have patience. Although with a 10 gallon you wont need a bunch anyway. Get a decent sized chunk of LR and then use base bock for the rest. Within a few months, the good stuff on the LR will migrate onto the base rock and most likely the base rock will be out of sight under the LR anyway.

LR for 10 bucks a pound? That better be premium reef stuff that was pulled and overnighted the day before and shipped in water. 6.99-7.99 is the normal I see with rubble much cheaper at like 2.99 a pound. Speaking of which thats another route you might want to take for that small a tank, get LR rubble, some marine epoxy and build whatever you want your rock work to look like.

Your lighting needs to be at least 10k color rating if your set only has one bulb. If it has 2 then find a 10k and an actinic.

Never wish bad things on your LFS, where else are you going to trade stuff in when it misbehaves or out grows your tank?

With your lack of a decent sized skimmer(I always overskim) theres a coral that should help you later on although you will have to trim it out every so often(remember that part above about trading things in?). You should look at xenia. It will grow quickly in theory(some tanks it grow like a weed, some it doesnt, kinda like goniporea survival rates) in not too heavily skimmed tanks and will help maintain water quality and looks cool.

Dont worry about softies getting too big, they are typically easy to frag out and bring to your store, especially leathers. My mind is sending up flags about Kenya Tree but i cant remember why.

RODI machine is great although if its old you will probably want to pick up new filters for it otherwise it wont help any as the filter wear out after awhile of use. What do you mean, big one or small one?

If you buy LR at petco or anyplace for that matter, look closely at it. If you see a pinkish/brownish stalk with tentcles on the end, dont buy it or any other rock from that tank. Thats a nuisance anemone called aiptasia(sp?). Its easy to google if you want a better pic and look up majano while your at it, much less common but still an utter pain to deal with. Dont let any LFS sucker you into buying it as a "cheap coral" either. It will take over your tank and kill your other corals, can survive in the dark or months without food. Can also simply hide for several months before appearing so observation isnt even 100% but helps alot.

How close to the coast are you? On another forum I am on, theres a few guys who go out in Puget Sound and gather their own stuff. Alot of cool coldwater stuff which thankfully doesnt come into the reef hobby much.

Speaking of that, got a heater? You will want to keep the tank around 79-80 F. I cant see you needing more than one small powerhead in a 10 gallon. Powerhead is a powerhead, your freshwater one should work fine if its not too strong.

Good luck, a small tank is hard to do. I have had them off and on over the years for frag tanks and such. Your better off with more water and i think a 64w would still be suffiecient for the 20t with the corals we are talking about if you have the right bulb. You might want to think about going to home depot and building or buying a light setup with two bulbs. Should be very easy, not much work involved and would help tremendously, plus with florescent lighting, pretty cheap. Only slightly more with power compacts with expoential benefits.
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Old 01-27-2010, 02:37 PM   #12
 
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A quick welcome to Bluetangclan on TFK. There are many different ways to approach this hobby, and I think we will have some welcome contributions from Tim.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetangclan View Post
A one inch bed mightl cause you issues in the long run.
The differences in our approach start with the basics. I personally strongly advocate a 1'' sand bed or less, or going a full 4'' to 6'' depth. I have had difficulty in the past with sand beds between the 1'' and 4'' range, which is why I suggested staying under 1'' on this particular thread. To BTC's credit, the sand debate is alive and well in this hobby. Many experienced hobbyists have arrived at different conclusions on what works best in their systems.

Quote:
LR for 10 bucks a pound? That better be premium reef stuff that was pulled and overnighted the day before and shipped in water. 6.99-7.99 is the normal I see with rubble much cheaper at like 2.99 a pound. Speaking of which thats another route you might want to take for that small a tank, get LR rubble, some marine epoxy and build whatever you want your rock work to look like.
Agreed and GREAT IDEA!

Quote:
Your lighting needs to be at least 10k color rating if your set only has one bulb. If it has 2 then find a 10k and an actinic.
I would personally not have any issues in attempting a very simple reef with easy to keep soft corals under the current lighting. That being said, adding an actinic would greatly improve the color. If you are handy, then a trip to Home Depot might help.

Quote:
Dont worry about softies getting too big, they are typically easy to frag out and bring to your store, especially leathers. My mind is sending up flags about Kenya Tree but i cant remember why.
Funny, I had the same gut instinct. Perhaps Wake or OF2F can chime in on this.

Quote:
Powerhead is a powerhead, your freshwater one should work fine if its not too strong.
Just be careful with stuff you bought at a yard sale, etc. Some of the older models do not have chords that are submersible in saltwater. If you are buying a power head made for an aquarium, then all is good.

Great thread here. This will be fun!
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Old 01-27-2010, 03:55 PM   #13
 
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ok well i just went to petco and i got some freshwater fish (4 yellow labs, adorible!!), anyways, they had bads of sand for like $20 for 10lbs, and 20lbs for $35, are these good prices or hsould i just order it online and while im at it some salt online? the salt was $15 for a 25gal tank (that is how it was measured, not quite sure what it means). hte power head is relativly new and it was bought at a fish store so it should work good. im not very handy with lights so ill just keep them as is and then just change if something goes wrong.... well since a kenya tree seems to have a bad rep for some reason ill just be safe and not go with it. i also love the big circle ones that are kinda like shrooms that are flat, if someone could put a name to it, that would be great, i really like the purple ones and green ones. i do really love that idea of the rubble pieces and will definatly look into it. So since i got those fish i wont have any more money for a bit, but i remember because i got myself a cell phone for christmas i have a mail in rebate of $50 comming my way soon i could get a lot of stuff and probably start the tank up. for now i gotta clean it cause its sitting with water and sand in my room.... not good lol. i think im gonna go with a 1" sandbed because its just a bit much considering the price of everything else. 10lbs should be enough because the baggie was about 1" thick and look like the dimensions of my tank. if i need more ill simply get another bag. ill check the prices of the nice fish store but they will probably be more since its not commercialy owned..... but if its only like $5 more ill get it there to support LFS. hmmm well i agree with pasfur, this is gonna be a great thread with lots of info for other onlookers :)
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Old 01-27-2010, 06:57 PM   #14
 
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ok so im looking around at some gobies and i have just fallen in love.... i gotta have this fish, a manderin goby. if someone could tell me what they need and everything, i have the time to feed it and will do everything i can to get one. has anyone ever had experience with it? what saltwater foods are thier for carnivores, are there frozen or pelets or does it have to be alive? any other interesting facts? how big do they get? will they team up with a pistol shrimp? how much would they cost? is it ok to order saltwater fish online? any sites that offer this fish? is it even sutable for a 10gal? ive read some storries about it being in 10gal tanks.
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Old 01-27-2010, 08:58 PM   #15
 
You kicked an anthill on this one. To sum up the answer for the Manderin, NO. That is a very special fish requiring a huge tank, not for growth, but so theres enough rock for it to hunt pods on without wiping them all out. I wouldnt buy one unless you had a minimum of a mature 75gal reef tank with 100+ pounds of rock. Seeing as how thats likely a bit out of your price range, stay away from this fish. I would be willing to bet 95% die early from people either not knowing better or thinkng they know better. Beautiful fish, dont waste your time, money, and its life. It wont eat pellets, flake, frozen or anything like that, only live food and it hunts all day.

On a side note its not really a goby, its a dragonette along with the green spotted dragonette and the also misnamed scooter blenny. No it wont team up with a shrimp, they are solitary critters.

I have no problem except for logistics when it comes to buying fish online. Solved that by having UPS or whoever delivers it to work and take a half day. Theres a few fairly reliable online vendors, others are sketchy. The Drs run a pretty tight ship, in the distant past, I ordered from saltwaterfish.com with good results as well. There are a bunch out there. First thing I would check is the sponsors for this site and see what they offer. You will find online goods cheaper for the most part than your LFS.

Again, its not suitable for a 10gal, it would have it cleared of pods within a day.

You should have enough sand I think. The salt was enough to make 25 gallons of saltwater. The shroom things are called mushrooms(rodactis I think is part of the scientific?). They would be great for your tank. Zoanthids would do well too along with star polyps and yellow polyps. Check your local Craigslist after your tank has been through its cycle and maybe you will find some cheap.

Again, no mandarin. If you look on the saltwater fish forum, the fish not for beginners, I think the very first person who posted put that one there. Not enough rock for them to eat off of.
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Old 01-27-2010, 09:14 PM   #16
 
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awwww ok well since i trust ya guys im not doing it, just sounded so convincing online :( also i wasnt thinking of kenya trees, it was actualy xenia or w/e its called. so with the $50 ill probably buy 20lps of live sand, 15lbs of "rubble" (free shipping yay) and salt and the test kits necesary. after that ill work on getting money for skimmer then some live stuff... i have a question, is a CUC necesary or optional in a 10gal, it just seems like a bunch of snails wouldnt fit in the tank with an invert and a fish.... also, other then crabs and shrimp what other inverts are suitable for this tank, if any?
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Old 01-27-2010, 10:19 PM   #17
 
Well I would go with two astrea snails once the cycle is done or at least the Nitrite and Ammonia is at zero. I would get those regardless of what else you get along with a couple red leg hermits. A healthy tank will always have diatoms on the glass and rock and detritus to get rid of. But dont over do it, definatetely no not go by any of those packages you see online. They tend to be a bit out of whack with numbers. Then think about what small fish. If I get a chance at work I will see if I can find some suggestions for fish you might like that will do ok in a tiny tank.

Xenia might do ok in your tank actually and if it does take off, it will help with cleaning the water. Was it this thread it was mentioned that in some tanks it works, and some it doesnt? No reason I know of why even between tanks with identical specs.It looks cool and it moves too. My tanks have always been of the cant grow it type.
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Old 01-28-2010, 06:18 AM   #18
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluetangclan View Post
You kicked an anthill on this one. To sum up the answer for the Manderin, NO. That is a very special fish requiring a huge tank, not for growth, but so theres enough rock for it to hunt pods on without wiping them all out. I wouldnt buy one unless you had a minimum of a mature 75gal reef tank with 100+ pounds of rock. It wont eat pellets, flake, frozen or anything like that, only live food and it hunts all day.
I want to reinforce this. Every month or so there is somebody who "finds" a Mandarine that is eating flakes or brine shrimp and they buy it. This is the equivalent of feeding your dog ice creme and thinking that it actually gets the necessary nutritional value from what it is eating. A Mandarine REQUIRES a huge micofauna population to survive. They graze all day, and need a large tank to allow for the demands they place on the copepods and amphipod populations.

On the CUC, i agree that every tank needs one and a small tank especially. A couple of crabs and 1 o 2 snails is about all you want or could support in that tank. The CUC will keep the sand stirred and help prevent detritus from settling on rocks and sand. This is an important function for preventing algae and cyno outbreaks, which will be the most challenging aspect of keeping a small tank.
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Old 01-28-2010, 02:12 PM   #19
 
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so when im done with the CUC do they just stay in the tank or do i sell them back to the store? and also with the $50 im planning on buying, salt, and LR.... my mom made a deal that she will buy me sand and skimmer. the skimmer has to be under $50 with shipping so anything close to that would be nice. i could also just get the one on ebay that you recomended. as for the sand, ill probably just get it at petco or the salt water store.......
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Old 01-28-2010, 06:58 PM   #20
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pasfur View Post
The CUC will keep the sand stirred and help prevent detritus from settling on rocks and sand. This is an important function for preventing algae and cyno outbreaks, which will be the most challenging aspect of keeping a small tank.
This concept above applies forever. You will never be "done" with a CUC.

For $50, you won't beat the eBay model. Just keep in mind, at some point I am going to speak these words to you....
"No, I would not recommend that fish or coral, because your skimmer is not efficient enough."
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