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To much light?

This is a discussion on To much light? within the Beginner Planted Aquarium forums, part of the Beginner Freshwater Aquarium category; --> I find myself very comfortable with your advice and I intend to go along with it The immediate question is how much have I ...

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Old 11-30-2010, 12:57 PM   #11
 
I find myself very comfortable with your advice and I intend to go along with it The immediate question is how much have I depleted the nutrients in the water and the substrate (6 weeks).

The Florite substrate (covered with gravel) varies from about 2 inches to about one inch. I suspect that plenty of nutrients remain there.

I propose to start changing the water in 20% daily increments. I don;t want to do more at one time. The little cats show distress even after such a relatively small change so I want to go easy.

Frankly I would prefer not to replace the water in its entirety but if its necessary I will do it in increments.

Do you have any thoughts on this?
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Old 11-30-2010, 01:32 PM   #12
 
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Originally Posted by sailnut View Post
I find myself very comfortable with your advice and I intend to go along with it The immediate question is how much have I depleted the nutrients in the water and the substrate (6 weeks).

The Florite substrate (covered with gravel) varies from about 2 inches to about one inch. I suspect that plenty of nutrients remain there.

I propose to start changing the water in 20% daily increments. I don;t want to do more at one time. The little cats show distress even after such a relatively small change so I want to go easy.

Frankly I would prefer not to replace the water in its entirety but if its necessary I will do it in increments.

Do you have any thoughts on this?
Any fish reacting negatively to a water change may be cause for concern. Can you explain this? I am taking "distress" to mean added stress apparent by rapid breathing, gasping, or lethargy.

Once you reduce the light, I would not not do anything other than stopping Excel. Continue with the regular weekly partial water change; I see no reason for a massive change. Use Flourish Comprehensive once a week [the nutrients in the Flourite substrate should mean less liquid is necessary than in my tanks with plain gravel]. Monitor the plants. Yellowing leaves means lack of nutrients (usually), but bear in mind that with these changes some of the plants may go through a readjustment. Swords sometimes lose outer leaves, but as long as the new growth continues from the centre of the crown all is probably fine. Swords are heavy feeders, but one does not want to overtip the balance.

Byron.
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Old 11-30-2010, 02:01 PM   #13
 
<Any fish reacting negatively to a water change may be cause for concern>

It was not a profound response. It was something intangible about their activity which perhaps could be characterized as a very mild lethargy. This gave me concern. (all in comparison to their generally hyper activity)

In the event they were back to normal in an hour or so and apparently there is no residual. I am in New York City and we have excellent tap water. I made sure that the replacement water was within one degree of the tank (79F) and used Seachem declorineator and anti-stress at the suggested dosage.

The replacement water was added via ladling from the stainless steel container into the filter overflow via a 1 quart Pyrex measuring cup. For future changes I will let the replacement water sit overnight.
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Old 11-30-2010, 03:58 PM   #14
 
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Originally Posted by sailnut View Post
<Any fish reacting negatively to a water change may be cause for concern>

It was not a profound response. It was something intangible about their activity which perhaps could be characterized as a very mild lethargy. This gave me concern. (all in comparison to their generally hyper activity)

In the event they were back to normal in an hour or so and apparently there is no residual. I am in New York City and we have excellent tap water. I made sure that the replacement water was within one degree of the tank (79F) and used Seachem declorineator and anti-stress at the suggested dosage.

The replacement water was added via ladling from the stainless steel container into the filter overflow via a 1 quart Pyrex measuring cup. For future changes I will let the replacement water sit overnight.
Interesting. Is this normal, at each water change? If so, it would suggest a difference in the water, which can be as obvious as pH/hardness, or perhaps heavy metals, nitrate, nitrite, ammonia in the water. Have you tested the water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate? And have you checked the water supply website? There should be a breakdown of substances in the water and an indication of hardness and pH.

I change 50% of my tanks weekly, and I run the tap water straight into the tank (at approx the same temp), squirting the conditioner in after I start. Aside from common "annoyance" at having me crashing around in the tank, there is no adverse reaction.
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Old 11-30-2010, 07:11 PM   #15
 
<Have you tested the water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate? >

Indeed I have. I have been testing every other day All 3 substances have been zero since I started the tank! There is no question about this... confirmed by 2 different test kits.

I have only made one water change 20% and after seeing mindful of the water test results and the reaction of the catfish I have not made another one.

The tank is hosting 3 small angels 3 dwarf garoumies, 4 catfish 10 snails and about 30 shrimp Ghost & Cherry). The Cherry's are breeding. I saw a baby maybe 1/32 of inch long caught in the filter circulation a few days ago.

The rock shelf at the end of the tank was constructed to house the shrimp. Its under the filter outflow which flush out various tunnels and crevices.

At the LFS suggestion the Garoumies were added to cycle the tank. The Angles were purchased with the expectation that only two would mature and they (with the exception of the cat's) would be the sole occupants of the tank.

Tomorrow I am going to buy a strip light fixture and the bulbs and see how it goes.


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Old 11-30-2010, 07:32 PM   #16
 
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Originally Posted by sailnut View Post
<Have you tested the water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate? >

Indeed I have. I have been testing every other day All 3 substances have been zero since I started the tank! There is no question about this... confirmed by 2 different test kits.

I have only made one water change 20% and after seeing mindful of the water test results and the reaction of the catfish I have not made another one.

The tank is hosting 3 small angels 3 dwarf garoumies, 4 catfish 10 snails and about 30 shrimp Ghost & Cherry). The Cherry's are breeding. I saw a baby maybe 1/32 of inch long caught in the filter circulation a few days ago.

The rock shelf at the end of the tank was constructed to house the shrimp. Its under the filter outflow which flush out various tunnels and crevices.

At the LFS suggestion the Garoumies were added to cycle the tank. The Angles were purchased with the expectation that only two would mature and they (with the exception of the cat's) would be the sole occupants of the tank.

Tomorrow I am going to buy a strip light fixture and the bulbs and see how it goes.

I wasn't clear in my last post, sorry; I meant, have you tested the tap water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate? Some tap water contains one or more of these, and sometimes at high levels. A sudden influx of such water could be troublesome esp to corys that are sensitive to such things. On this line, what conditioner do you use? Some will detoxify ammonia (they change it to harmless ammonium), but only Prime will also detoxify nitrite and nitrate should either be in the tap water.

You do know that the angels will quickly outgrow a 20g? They will need at least a 55g (4-foot) tank. And sooner than you may think. Fish need "space" (not only physical but water issues too) to grow properly or they can become stunted and this weakens the immune system bringing on other health problems. I would not combine gourami with angels, but that's another topic.
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Old 11-30-2010, 07:59 PM   #17
 
<I meant, have you tested the tap water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?>

No I did not and I suppose its possible that there was some ammonia in the water I was more concerned with Chlorine. I am using Seachem Prime as you are.

<You do know that the angels will quickly outgrow a 20g?>


Belive it or not there is some debate on this issue. It appears that a lot of people are spawning pairs in 20 gallon tanks. Everyone is consitent in urging a high tank such as mine because of the fishes unusual conformation.

<I would not combine gourami with angels>

Not the Dwarf's ... harmony reins! Both swim around peacefully. Surprisinly the Angels and gouramis have a grear fondness for algea pellets over Brine Shrimp. A couple of days ago a ghost shrimp walked up to an Angel and swated it of the way. The fish have generaly ignored the shrimp since I introduced them. However most shrimp activity judging by food consumption takes place after lights out. I am hoping that the Cherry shrimp will move into the Java Moss after it becomes a bit more established.
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Old 11-30-2010, 08:06 PM   #18
 
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There is no debate on the angels among knowledgeable aquarists. A spawning pair in a 20g high is a very, very different thing from having a trio of angels in the same tank. They need (and deserve for their own good health and a normal life) to be given what they must have. Read the info in our profile of this fish which will explain why. Pterophyllum scalare, the shaded name will take you direct to the profile.

At present peace may reign but I can assure you it will not last and the fish will suffer. Obviously "small" means the angels are young. When they attain 6 inches in length and have fins up to 10 inches in height, will there still be peace in the tank? No. These fish have a social structure to their group, inherent in them by nature, and that cannot be ignored.
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Old 11-30-2010, 08:45 PM   #19
 
Getting a bit ahead of ourselves here... got to walk before I run. Once I get this light thing straightened out and everything running smoothly I can consider my options.

If nothing else my concept of housing shrimp and fish in a more or less naturalistic way seems to be playing out OK.

On learns by ones mistakes. There is an awful lot of information on fish keeping (much contradictory) around the web, an example, the bit with the Angel fish.

I am a home theater nut, RC Model aircraft and digital photography enthusiast but none of these hobbies has so much in the way of contradictory opinions offered up by so many self made pundits. There is nothing subjective about the output of a given bulb. It's measurable and should be presented in an agreed upon universal format . It took me 3 weeks to determine exactly what type of bulb was furnished with my strip light. Such a situation is non acceptable. Coralife advertised it as a 65 watt bub PERIOD! Not overly informative that.

I can take a model aircraft electric motor made by an obscure oriental manufacturer and get its operating parameters within minutes and there are hundreds of these motors in various sizes and form factors available.

My lighting misfortune is a beautiful example. In the RC model hobby there are spread sheets were one enters the data and tn response a suggested matrix of optimal components is generated. The needed raw data regarding the intensity and light quality of the various bulb options is available. Its a misfortune that no similar spread sheet exists. Yes I have seen the published graphs and there seems to be a matrix table around both of which make my eyes cross.

The present tank appeared to be about the minimum size for a budget starter tank if things work out I want to scale up from the subject aquarium.
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Old 11-30-2010, 10:04 PM   #20
 
Again Byron, you add so much to the discussion.
Beautiful tanks too on this thread!
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