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jungle val not doing well...

This is a discussion on jungle val not doing well... within the Beginner Planted Aquarium forums, part of the Beginner Freshwater Aquarium category; --> Update: Both GH and KH values came out at 50-70 ppm. pH ~6.5.......

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jungle val not doing well...
Old 10-04-2012, 08:53 AM   #21
 
Update: Both GH and KH values came out at 50-70 ppm. pH ~6.5....
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Old 10-04-2012, 01:02 PM   #22
 
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Update: Both GH and KH values came out at 50-70 ppm. pH ~6.5....
Here's the problem, in my view. A GH of 70ppm [= 4 dGH] is usually given as the minimum for most plants [again, it is the calcium primarily, and magnesium]. Vallisneria being hard water needs more, and with this low a GH and a pH of 6.5 I would expect the KH (bicarbonates) to be low too, so carbon from that source is not forthcoming.

Some authors say that Vallisneria can "adapt" to softer water, whatever this may mean. Mine is not. And my GH is now running between 5 and 6 dGH, with pH around mid-6's. So I would suggest that the low GH is likely the main issue here.

In this situation one has to decide whether to raise the GH and what effects that may have elsewhere, or leave it (for the benefit of fish, presumably) and accept that Vallisneria will not be at its best, and possibly replace it with something that will work.

Byron.
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Old 10-04-2012, 01:35 PM   #23
 
As for adaptability, it does say so in the plant profiles here in this site. And it seems from some posts here people have had some success with soft water. However, I do agree that seems to be main issue here. The reason I am hesitant to adding some chemical to raise the hardness is that I want my cardinals happy in there, As such they are sensitive/delicate fish, mostly..... May be I can add some crushed corals in canister? Or may some epsom salt while PWC? Nothing else, I will just the val stay as is, as along as it's not rotting......
Thanks again for all the help :)
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Old 10-04-2012, 06:55 PM   #24
 
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Originally Posted by rg0p View Post
As for adaptability, it does say so in the plant profiles here in this site. And it seems from some posts here people have had some success with soft water. However, I do agree that seems to be main issue here. The reason I am hesitant to adding some chemical to raise the hardness is that I want my cardinals happy in there, As such they are sensitive/delicate fish, mostly..... May be I can add some crushed corals in canister? Or may some epsom salt while PWC? Nothing else, I will just the val stay as is, as along as it's not rotting......
Thanks again for all the help :)
As I mentioned previously, this is a case where (in my view) the fish must come first. I do not raise my GH above 5 or 6 dGH, depending upon the tank, as I have a number of wild caught soft water fish like (and including) cardinals. A scientific study found they were OK in water with a GH of 4, but above this they became susceptible to "hard water" issues like calcium blockage of the kidneys, leading to premature death. The higher the GH, the worse the blockages and sooner death.

I have near-zero GH out of the tap, which is superb for my fish, but I can't keep plants alive with so little calcium/magnesium, so I use Equilibrium from Seachem to add these. But I do not go above 5 or 6 dGH. But having tried Vallisneria, and had it basically fail, that's it; I am not going to jeopardize the fish just to have one plant when there are so many others.

Crushed coral will add calcium, but it also raises the pH sky-high. I have tried this; as little as half a cup in the filter of my 115g tank raised the GH by 1 but sent the pH from 6 up to 7.6. Not a solution obviously. Epsom salt, which is magnesium sulfate, will also raise the GH, but this is only via magnesium; the calcium is completely lacking. And when I tried this in one tank, the excess of magnesium resulted in the swords developing holes; there was obviously a chain reaction with other nutrients.

If I had a GH of 4 out of the tap, I would be in heaven. Equilibrium is not inexpensive.

Byron.
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Old 10-04-2012, 08:18 PM   #25
 
Agreed. Fish comes first in this case. I don't want to hurt my fish esp the cardinals. Jungle val will stay as long as it's not decaying. Who knows they may start to take off after a while!! Wishful thinking, I know!! Later, I may try small doses of Epsom salt and/or some calcium sulfate. Thay way pH will not be affected much, but I'd still watch that GH doesn't get too much above 4-5.... If that doesn't help, so be it...
Thanks... :)
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Old 10-08-2012, 11:51 AM   #26
 
I have val in my Tanganyika tanks, sand substrate, pH=7.8, with plant tabs when I remember and T8 tubes.

Both 55's have older bulbs on one side, and of course the vals do much better on the new tube side.
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