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flourish

5K views 30 replies 11 participants last post by  onemanswarm 
#1 ·
Just a quick question... Im ordering seachem flourish for the first time, seeing as my LFS has been unable to get my old liquid fert for some time now. I was just going to get the mega jug (2 liters) but it says that it needs to be refrigerated. Does anyone actually do this?

does anyone know how it works without refrigerating it?

if thats the case I might just stick with my old stuff which I THINK its nutrafin plant-gro (not 100% though). Opinions appreciated :)
 
#2 ·
I refrigerate it but not sure if it is completely necessary , and I would recommend a smaller size if you have to and not get the old plant fert.
 
#4 ·
I remember seeing that post also. Someone actually emailed them and while I dont' completely remember the response was just like the label they "recommend" it but said it is fine without it. Me personally I refrigerate mine, they must of "recommeded" it for a reason, unless they just wanted to sit back and laugh while watching people put it in there fridge lol
 
#30 ·
Hi all,

I emailed them a few months back, pretty fast response time too (20mins) here ya go:

"I was wondering why refrigeration recommended but not necessary for most of your products. I was mainly concerned with Flourish comprehensive. Also, if you open but do not refrigerate for a while, is it harmful to then start refrigerating, or if you refrigerate it then will it spoil if you decide to stop refrigerating it, or you forget to put it back in the fridge for a while?"

Thank you for using our products and for your question. None of the Flourish products have shelf lives, and they will therefore not go bad, whether or not they have been refrigerated. In all honesty, we do not refrigerate any of the products that we use on our tanks here at Seachem. Refrigerating them may cut down on the potential of any type of bacterial growth that may occur, though this is really uncommon. You can refrigerate the products at any time, if you so decide, and if you forget to place it back in the fridge, there is no issue. We hope this information helps and that you have a wonderful day!
Product Support

 
#5 · (Edited)
I'm with kangy on this. I keep my jug in the wine fridge which is not as cold as the refrigerator, though I doubt that matters, just my preference. And yes, Seachem did tell us that it didn't matter, but like kangy I would wonder why they recommend it if it doesn't. My initial jug I did not, and I did notice it was "different" by the time i came to the bottom, in fact I threw it out and bought a new one, and have refrigerated since then. The subsequent jugs have not "changed."

On the size, it is considerably cheaper by the 2 liter jug, and it has no apparent shelf life. I can get the jug online for $31 whereas the 500ml bottle is $10 which would mean $40 for 2 liters in the smaller bottles; these prices are Canadian, from an online retailer, so you may get better deals in the US. However, if you have only one tank, you will obviously use much less than I do with 7 tanks (totalling 350 gallons) dosed twice a week so the cost is spread out more.
 
#6 ·
Well, I have 5 tanks totaling 215g, but i think im only going to dose my 20 long and my 55. The downside, is it isnt available locally ANYWHERE. The other crappy thing is I dont have a fridge on the same floor as the fish room, so I gotta hike 2x a week. But seeing as petco cant figure out how to keep something as simple and common as nutrafin plant-gro in stock (and it doses waaay less than an equal amount of flourish) I guess ill be making the switch.

Thanks for the input folks :)
 
#8 ·
Well, I have 5 tanks totaling 215g, but i think im only going to dose my 20 long and my 55. The downside, is it isnt available locally ANYWHERE. The other crappy thing is I dont have a fridge on the same floor as the fish room, so I gotta hike 2x a week. But seeing as petco cant figure out how to keep something as simple and common as nutrafin plant-gro in stock (and it doses waaay less than an equal amount of flourish) I guess ill be making the switch.

Thanks for the input folks :)
First, these two products are not at all the same. I can't find Nutrafin's ingredients [had this problem before, i think I finally read the label in the store] but from memory I believe it is only Micro-nutrients. That may or may not be sufficient, it depends upon your sources for macro-nutrients (primarily tap water, and fish foods). If my thinking is correct that Plant-Gro is micro, then it is comparable to Flourish Trace. Though without the ingredients and numbers, I can't say for sure that these are even close. If you have the bottle, and can post the list, I might be able to offer more.

Flourish Comprehensive is, as the name suggests, complete. The only nutrients missing are hydrogen [water], oxygen and carbon, and these three naturally occur in the aquarium. Brightwell Aquatics in the YUK make a very similar [going from the ingredients and percentages] product but it is more expensive.

As for dose, I believe Nutrafin takes much more than Flourish Comp. I did find that Nutrafin say 1 teaspoon for 10 gallons. Flourish Comp is one teaspoon for 30 gallons once a week. So Plant-Gro uses 3 times the product compared to Flourish Comp.

Byron.
 
#7 ·
I literally just opened my Dr. Foster's and Smith order and I got a 2 liter of Flourish. I will be putting that one in the fridge and put a small about in the smaller bottle which won't be in the fridge. It will be in the office where the tanks are.
 
#9 ·
from the petsmart website re: nutrafin plant-gro

Guaranteed Analysis:

Total Nitrogen (N) - 0.15% [0.15% Water Soluble Nitrogen - Chelating Agent]
Boron (B) - 0.0005%
Copper (Cu) - 0.0005% [0.0005% Chelated Copper (Cu)]
Iron (Fe) - 0.26% [0.26% Chelated Iron (Fe)]
Manganese (Mn) - 0.05% [0.05% Chelated Manganese (Mn)]
Molybdenum (Mo) - 0.0007%
Zinc (Zn) - 0.003% [0.003% Chelated Zinc (Zn)]

so its similar, even in percentages, however it lacks potash, calcium, magnesium, sulfer, chlorine, cobalt, and sodium. Similar, not as complete. The only lure to it was it readily available without having to order online, but now that thats gone by the way side, time to do the job right.

the dosing of flourish (in comparable terms) is 5ml for 60 gallons, while nutrafin plant gro is 5ml for 10 gallons! The hagen website is just awful as far as actual product information. I will evaluate the plants growth and aesthetics over time, and if need be test for individual nutrients, but we will burn that bridge later :)
 
#10 ·
from the petsmart website re: nutrafin plant-gro

Guaranteed Analysis:

Total Nitrogen (N) - 0.15% [0.15% Water Soluble Nitrogen - Chelating Agent]
Boron (B) - 0.0005%
Copper (Cu) - 0.0005% [0.0005% Chelated Copper (Cu)]
Iron (Fe) - 0.26% [0.26% Chelated Iron (Fe)]
Manganese (Mn) - 0.05% [0.05% Chelated Manganese (Mn)]
Molybdenum (Mo) - 0.0007%
Zinc (Zn) - 0.003% [0.003% Chelated Zinc (Zn)]

so its similar, even in percentages, however it lacks potash, calcium, magnesium, sulfer, chlorine, cobalt, and sodium. Similar, not as complete. The only lure to it was it readily available without having to order online, but now that thats gone by the way side, time to do the job right.

the dosing of flourish (in comparable terms) is 5ml for 60 gallons, while nutrafin plant gro is 5ml for 10 gallons! The hagen website is just awful as far as actual product information. I will evaluate the plants growth and aesthetics over time, and if need be test for individual nutrients, but we will burn that bridge later :)
My memory was accurate for once; Plant-Gro is just micro-nutrients, though two are missing, namely Chlorine and Nickel. This product is basically similar to Flourish Trace (this has a couple other nutrients, no idea why, and also lacks chlorine). As I said, if the macro nutrients are sufficient, either of these might be all you need.

The macro-nutrients (calcium, carbon, hydrogen, magnesium, nitrogen, oxygen, phosphorus, potassium and sulphur) are perhaps even more critical, and these occur in tap water (depending upon the hardness) and fish food (primarily when it becomes organic waste in the substrate). Most of these macros are also in Flourish.

Testing for individual nutrients is usually pointless, and some cannot be tested without scientific equipment. Appearance is the best guide. And knowing your tap water hardness, plus the fish load (the food). But symptoms of several deficiencies or excesses can be identical. Which is why most sources recommend a comprehensive dosing (if anything) of macros and trace. An excess of some trace minerals can be serious, as some of them (iron, copper, zinc, nickel, manganese) are highly toxic heavy metals. Plants can take these up in varying degrees and detoxify them, but one doesn't want to push the plant's capacity for this beyond reason. Which is why using a basic trace product, or a comprehensive, will almost always work. Everything is being provided but nothing is in excess. I have in the past dosed a few individual nutrients, with disastrous results, so I agree with those who suggest refraining.

Byron.
 
#11 ·
Thanks for this discussion guys ! It was really informative. I use Flourish Comprehensive, and I keep mine in the fridge, as they recommend. I got a small bottle though and the total volume of my tanks is about 100 gallons (including the 29G that I am setting up).
Still dreaming of when I can have a nice 125G :)
 
#12 ·
Im getting one of each, I have decided. The small bottle of plant gro has a dosing cap, so ill use it up, then refill the bottle with plant gro, keeping the big bottle in the fridge. This will give me at least a few weeks to note its performance before I switch to flourish.

this is, of course, just for fun. I will note my findings here :)

thanks alot everyone, its been fun digging that deep into things I slept right through in high school. I just spent like 3 hours looking up various dry ferts, and trying to figure out how their composition compares to flourish and plant-gro. My brain hurts.
 
#13 ·
You know what works amazing for dosing, whether it's ferts, water treatment, etc is those plastic medicine syringes. My wife works in a Pharmacy and brings them home for me. I use the thin 1ml one (has .1ml increments) for dosing .8ml in the 10g and the larger 5ml ones for dosing 2.25ml in the 29g. Exact measurements and super easy (at least I think it's easier than pouring into the lid) Most pharmacy's will probably give you a couple for free.

Edit: you can also use them as a dropper should you need that small a qty. I have one at work I use as a dropper for the water treatment when I do the 3g water changes.
 
#14 ·
ya know I was just trying to think of something. I found a website that sells premixed dry ferts that you have to mix with water. I was thinking about getting one for one tank, and flourish for another to compare them, as their macro nutrient numbers are way off. It gets mixed with water then literally droppered into the water 1-5 drops per day. A plastic syringe might be the hot ticket. I might have some left over from when we had to medicate our rat.
 
#17 ·
IMO dry ferts are more for high tech set up with intense light
 
#18 ·
IMO dry ferts are more for high tech set up with intense light
I would agree Chris. Daily dosing of these macro-nutrients has to be balanced by micro-nutrients, carbon and higher light than what those of us with natural systems have; if not, you run the risk of overloading the system. Once or at most twice a week using a comprehensive nutrient supplement is all that should be required in a low-tech system.

Byron.
 
#19 ·
well, the thought was I could balance them myself, as they are separate components, IF need be. I figure dry ferts would literally last me for years, because I would only need a tiny tiny bit probably once or twice a week at most.

but either way, im going to go ahead with the flourish. I can only imagine 2 liters of the stuff should last me long enough that ordering more off the net shouldnt be an inconvenience :)
 
#21 ·
Great point. I've been using Flourish in a tank with inverts for that very reason. A quick question on that topic: what's the best way to disperse liquid fertilizer around the tank?

It would be easy enough to mix it with new water during a PWC, but Byron's article recommends dosing the day after a PWC due to the potential impact of water conditioners on some of the key nutrients. Instead, I've been using my little plastic syringe and pumping small amounts in 5-6 areas around the tank at about half depth. I want it to be spread around evenly, but I worry that if one of the invertebrates is exposed to a concentrated dose (e.g., ghost shrimp swimming full face into a fresh squirt of Flourish before it dissipates), it could be harmful. Any thoughts on that? How are you actually dispersing the liquid?
 
#23 ·
I agree w/Byron. I add a day after water change and will even turn off my hob's and just let my bubblers cycle it through the tank for a good 30 minutes. I have noticed that since I changed to Flourish my floating plants are taking over so now I need to spend more time keeping them in control. I purchased two 5x5 pieces of Xmas moss on some stretchy sock mesh and put them both on a rock and in a few weeks this stuff has taken off like crazy. my neon's go in it and disappear as well as my adult RCS. I add another dose three days later. With all that being said I like your idea on how to apply it. I just get my measuring cup and fill it w/tank water and add the Flourish then dump out small amounts all over the tank. I also always say what ever works for you is the best way to do it as long as its successful. hope this helps
 
#24 ·
It likely doesn't matter much where you add it, but I usually add liquids (Flourish, or medications like CopperSafe when that is necessary) next to the filter return. This way it immediately gets into the water stream moving away from the filter spray bar or whatever.
 
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