Cycle Before Adding Plants ? - Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources
 
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post #1 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 07:57 AM Thread Starter
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Cycle Before Adding Plants ?

In an article in Tropical Fish Hobbyist, the author stated that the tank should be cycled before adding live plants. While I can see where this certainly wouldn't hurt, it somewhat contradicts the theory of partially circumventing the traditional cycling with the use of plants, in my opinion. The author also promotes the use of surface agitation to increase CO2 in low tech set ups. Don't know if there is a connection within her approach. I'd be interested in hearing members' comments.

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post #2 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 09:25 AM
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Plants circumvent the cycle making it unnecessary. The nitrifying organisms still will grow and multiply creating a full cycle but they are not needed to accommodate the ammonia with plants in place.Although with enough plants the cycle would not be needed but it happens anyway, just in the background. Plants can, depending upon the variety, consume ammonia between 5 and 50 times faster than nitrifying organisms... I wish I could find that study again but I failed to retain the link.

Why bother cycling the tank when you can plant and add fish quite safely right away?

I do also believe that the cycle will happen faster with plants in place than in the empty tank.

As far as aeration is concerned... agitation will serve to offgas any CO2 beyond the saturation level that the water can maintain given the setup. If there were only plants it would increase CO2 (tried this myself and it works in a plant only environment) as the plants would, during the day, use the CO2 faster than the air/water transfer will make it up. With fish, decomposing waste and the normal air/water transfer, aeration will serve to potentially reduce the CO2 available to the plants in the tank unless the tank was kept extremely clean and a very low level of fish stocking were maintained.

Will it hurt to cycle first, no. With a new tank I would prefer to not have to wait the month or two for the cycle to start playing in the sand.

Jeff.


Total years fish keeping experience: 7 months, can't start counting in years for a while yet.

The shotgun approach to a planted tank with an LED fixture

Small scale nitrogen cycle with a jar, water and fish food; no substrate, filter etc
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post #3 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 10:17 AM
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I concur with Jeff. In more than 20 years I have started dozens of tanks by planting well and adding fish immediately, I have never "cycled," and I've never had ammonia or nitrite issues.

I subscribe to TFH but I can't recall reading this, can you point me to the article and issue? I would like to see it to know the exact context.

Byron.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #4 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 11:28 AM Thread Starter
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The issue as shown on the spine of the magazine is November 2012 Volume LXI Number 3 #680. Setting Up a Successful Low-Teck Planted Tank Like a Pro, Part 1: Planted Tank Basics. Author is Lea Maddocks.

I agree with you both...was trying not to use universal terms.

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post #5 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fish monger View Post
The issue as shown on the spine of the magazine is November 2012 Volume LXI Number 3 #680. Setting Up a Successful Low-Teck Planted Tank Like a Pro, Part 1: Planted Tank Basics. Author is Lea Maddocks.

I agree with you both...was trying not to use universal terms.
Yes, I remember the article (it was in 2 parts). When I read through it at the time, I thought how almost identical it was to my little effort A Basic Approach to the Natural Planted Aquarium. I must have missed the initial "Basic Water Chemistry" sentence, which I've just re-read, and I would disagree with it for the reasons already stated in this thread.

Thanks for the reference.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #6 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 11:55 AM
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Me three.

I firmly believe that you should "cycle" the tank with plants not cycle the tank then add the plants.

I use no mechanical filtration or circulation and my tanks all have high pH (purple 8.4-8.8 with the api high range test kit) after a few weeks. So it could be entirly true that adding circulation would increase the CO2 through surface gas exchange. But I don't really care or simply cannot see why a system that reduces CO2 could be anything but beneficial to the fish.

But then that's just my .02

maintain Fw and marine system with a strong emphasis on balanced, stabilized system that as much as possible are self substaning.

have maintained FW systems for up to 9 years with descendants from original fish and marine aquariums for up to 8 years.

With no water changes, untreated tap water, inexpensive lighting by first starting the tank with live plants (FW) or macro algae( marine)

see: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/a...-build-295530/
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post #7 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 12:09 PM Thread Starter
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There is nothing little about your effort, Byron. At times, I bring these articles up for the sake of discussion and when I see information from people with beautifully planted tanks doing things contrary to my opinion.

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post #8 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 03:29 PM
Like everyone else, I plant my tanks immediately and have never really had to cycle any of my tanks.
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post #9 of 9 Old 04-26-2013, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SinCrisis View Post
Like everyone else, I plant my tanks immediately and have never really had to cycle any of my tanks.
+1
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