What do we really need? - Page 4 - Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources
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post #31 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 08:30 AM Thread Starter
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Oh man!!!! I'm sorry!!! Looking forward to your essay.
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post #32 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 08:40 AM
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Haha that convo went awesome. He got well and truly told. You go girl! Haha

Yes you need a Hoover no matter what as which ever substrate your fish are still going to poop, and it all.collects somewhere.....

Hoovering sand I have no idea about as I've not ha d it yet but I'm actually interested to find out as I'll be adding it to my 60ltr after the new year.

Now water changes are simple. You should effectively take care of the emptying part whilst you do the hoovering tbh in a 20 gallon. This will likely be into a bucket as I think it's easiest.

Now when it comes to filling it you have 2 main options. You can fill a bucket straight from the taps, add the conditioner and then add to tank.

Or you can pre condition the tank and fill straight from the taps to tank with extended hoses.

Some considerations here are water temp. I'm lucky that if I run both my taps on full the water comes out at 26.4 degrees. My tank sits at approx 26 so by time it's in its bang on. Worth checking yours to see how this goes. You obviously don't want to fill straight to the tank with 12' water into a 26' tank. Would cause your fish to go into shock. Other options if need it is you can stick a heater in the bucket for 10 mins which should get it right.

To get this done I'd say you realistically need 2 20 ltr buckets, a vacuum and a water conditioner. Oh, and an old towel, I always need one. Haha.

I used to use a jug to put the water back in as tipping in a bucket would obviously cause major disturbance, others tip it onto a plate slowly to minimise the disturbance. Nowadays I spent approx $30 on a eheim water pump which I throw into the bucket and it l pumps the water back up jmto the tank for me. Easies. Lol.
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post #33 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 09:00 AM Thread Starter
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Makes sense. Okay. That sounds doable. So in a 20 gallon tank, how much should I be changing the water?
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post #34 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 09:46 AM
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Well early on if you put fish in with plants it could be anything up to daily. Up yo 50%.

What your aiming for essentially is

Ammonia- 0
Nitrites- 0
Nitrates 0 - 20max. People say 40. Lower is better.

If your ammonia/nitrites hit too high above 0 early on, say 2.0 for Am or 0.2 for trites you'll belooking to do a water change to lower them. The more live plants you have the lower these should be as plants absorb these. This is with fish in as these levels are harmful to them, and so whilst your tank is still cycling the workload will be more. One it's done your ammonia and nitrites should remain at 0 - plants and bacteria in your filter and substrate will do this - then your doing approx weekly 20-30% water changes to keep your nitrates down.
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post #35 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 09:51 AM Thread Starter
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Any starter fish recommendations? Since you're bored?
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post #36 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 09:55 AM
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Angel fish?
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post #37 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 09:58 AM Thread Starter
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Really????? Haha seriously.
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post #38 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 10:03 AM
Originally Posted by Fishybusiness View Post
Makes sense. Okay. That sounds doable. So in a 20 gallon tank, how much should I be changing the water?
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I never change water in my tanks.

my .02

maintain Fw and marine system with a strong emphasis on balanced, stabilized system that as much as possible are self substaning.

have maintained FW systems for up to 9 years with descendants from original fish and marine aquariums for up to 8 years.

With no water changes, untreated tap water, inexpensive lighting by first starting the tank with live plants (FW) or macro algae( marine)

see: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/a...-build-295530/
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post #39 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 10:11 AM
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Well there are varying amounts of water changes depending on the member in here and what they believe... AND how OCD or lazy you are. Most will suggest 30%-50% weekly as your fish are living in their own pee. Ooops sorry is that a surprise? Well it's true.
Fresh clean water is the best medicine and a good routine of weekly water changes will keep control of excessive amounts of Ammonia, NitrIte and NitrAte. More to follow on these once you setting up. Have you read the articles on Cycling a new tank?
So... anyway... I am one of the lazy ones... ehhhemmmm. So I do about 25%-30% every 2 weeks. Yes I know it should be more but I also have a turtle that needs them almost 2 x a week so I have that darn hose laying about all the time.
Water changes will require a thermometer for sure. Get the floaty kind, they bob about the tank, or you can put it into one of the filter chambers. You will need a separate bucket just for your fish, never to be used for anything else... ever, ever, never, never. I have a juice jug, marg container, cups and tubs, a couple of scrubby pads, pair of scissors, a turkey baster, set of measuring spoons, and small pocket calender.... kept all in a big tote (or cupboard in the stand under the tank) If you ever get another tank (he,he,he... !) you have a full set of these for each tank. No cross contaminating!! (get as much as you can out of your kitchen cupboards or the Dollar store!!)
(Wait till she walks past the Bettas at the local fish store (LFS) and he wiggles his little fins Hello at her!)
When you are at the LFS this week, look to see if they have made things simple for you by putting red, green, yellow stickers on the tanks. Green is Community fish, Yellow is caution, and Red is doesn't play well with others!! (one species only tank).
Sorry back to water changes.... Starting out, you would open the lid, use one of your marg tubs, scoop water into the bucket and take it to a sink and pour it out. When you have removed 1/3 you check the water temp in the tank, go run the water in the sink that you can get your bucket under the faucet, and using as close as possible, within 2 degrees max, treat the water with de-chlor and take the full bucket back to the tank and pour directly in, or scoop the new water back in with the tub. When you are fully tired of that method.... next Christmas you will be asking for a "python" style hose that you connect directly to the faucet which uses siphoning to pull out the old water, close the shut off valve, put the de-chlor directly into the tank, set the temp at the sink, reverse flow..... open the valve and fill the tank. DO NOT go too far from the tank at this point... do not answer the door, go do laundry, go for a nap... etc. lol or you will have a rather wet floor! Ya I've done it!! Shut off the valve when full, run back to the sink and shut off the water. Does that give you a visual of the 2 processes?
(by the way, you are almost at 15 posts which will get you any time into the Chat room to speak live with other members when they are in there! You can see if someone is in there down at the bottom of the main menu, it lists the names of those chatting at that moment). Come visit us some time.
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post #40 of 154 Old 12-28-2012, 10:21 AM
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god no. never the angels. haha. TBH we really cant help you with these fish as what you get first could determine what you can put in the tank after, so really you need that list of what you want etc and from there people can help you make the right decisions.

bealsbub does his a little differently in that he's right, you can never change the water, but he effectively builds self sustaining eco systems which require a little more thought etc. I wouldnt have a clue on these though tbh.

and jakies given you a nice cheap way of doing it - though jackie - a marge tub to the sink and back constantly? No wonder its a WC every 2 weeks, that sounds like it would break me!!!

Personally i still think the hoovering method is best, as effectively its a water pump, taking out your water, you just happen to be cleaning the gravel at the same time. But atbthe end of the day, you'll find a million different methods on how to do it, its what you find that suits YOU which will work best for you!

off to the LFS mow for a good peruse and to see if i can spend some of my christmas vouchers :)
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