Starting a 29g and clueless.
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Starting a 29g and clueless.

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Starting a 29g and clueless.
Old 01-09-2013, 05:19 AM   #1
 
Starting a 29g and clueless.

Hello Everyone!
I'd like to start a predatory tank. Something that I could toss a guppy or two in and watch them chase it. I would also like to Aquascape it with real plants and preferable sand though i'm not sure if sand would be a better choice over gravel. I just really want something where it will be truely amazing! Colorful fish that will eat others lol, real plants, and hopefully not too much maintenance (apart from water changes). As of right now I have a 29g tank and would like to have an idea on what fish to put in before i begin aquascaping/cycling the tank. I also have a ten gallon tank cycling right now for some guppies that i'll breed for food. Any ideas on what i could throw into the tank? Possibly any really cool fish that have a "act" so to say that would beat watching a predator chase and feed? Oh also fairly easy breeding for the future would be a plus :D. So far that's all I can think of right now.

Thanks!
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:48 AM   #2
 
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Not alot tbh that you can keep thats predatory in a 29 gallon tank. certainly not your name sake the piranha! need a group and a massive tank!

Few options are;

Dwarf puffer tank - small but aggressive little buggers! They'll have a pop at anything. More likely to kill the fish though than eat it- as fish are fatty and not good for their diet, so then you have rotting issues and DP's demand perfect water! Will eat lots of live bloodworm/daphnia etc, things like that.

Red wolf fish - THINK you could keep one of these in a tank that size- depends on dimensions, 36 12 12 is minimum though 55 gallon 4 ft would be better.

Leaf fish - these would chow down on an guppy but need a good established tank, lots of planmts, leaves etc and basically cover.

MOST predatory fish btw will be boring as anything 90% of the time except when they are eating for you....and thats only if they do it on YOUR timeframe which is unlikely probably.

All in all IMO if you really want proper predatory fish you really need a bigger tank to house them in, your looking at 48inch minimum and tbh the bigger tank, the ''better'' the fish you'll get for your purposes.

I didnt look into this too much when i was thinking about a predatory tank a while back - i went community, just weighing up all options, but these were a few that came up, and now im setting up a small DP species tank as i like these as though they dont eat guppys like you want, they are gorgeous and intelligent fish.

Last edited by Nilet699; 01-09-2013 at 05:52 AM..
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:21 AM   #3
 
I was looking into some small cichlids but wasn't sure about compatability among other cichlids or with other fish for that matter. Some have awesome colorations along with unique shapes and sizes. Any cool non-predatory fish to consider? I would like something entertaining. Maybe a chase or odd behaviors. What combination would be most rewarding? Would like multiple species :D. Lol alot to ask for such little to work with .

Thanks!
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:22 AM   #4
 
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Ok, now i've eaten, i'll get to he rest of the post.
I have a gravel and a sand tank - sand since yesterday! I LOVE the sand, looks gorgeous and a lot of people says its better for planting. some will obviously disagree, i havent formed an opinion yet! Its also cleaner as the detritus cant fall through the gravel due to its compact nature BUT because of this, you rely on plants/ornamnets and filter media much more for the de-nitrifying process.

HAVE you read up on cycling a tank? you REALLY need to.
Though with live plants, this process is cut Much shorter/immediate depending on the livestock you add.

read this for a start;

http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/f...m-cycle-38617/

now you said you want colourful fish that will eat other fish. you cant really have both. Most people go down the route of a community tank becasue they are great to scape and you can add some gorgeous fish in. predators, not so much IMO.

The 10 gallon that you spoke of, you could do the dwarf puffer tank i mentioned earlier for a ''predatory'' tank - though not quite in the terms you mentioned, but still.... and could have 1/2 in there........THOUGH i'd wait to do this until you are a bit more knowledgeable about the whiol fish keeping malarkey as they are quite demanding fish.

Until then you could use it as a quarantine tank for your bigger community tank IF you went this way.

What i'd really suggest more than anything though- IS SLOW DOWN. Start reading about the whole deal and asking questions, l'll gladly answer what i can all day for you, and so will others. The best key here is knowledge. Start looking up other people 29 gallon tank, and getting ideas, and then forming your own from them.
Keeping fish isnt just a buy and throw in, theres much more too it, and with a 29 gallon one of the things you'll encounter is fish need big spaces. You cant throw a small fish that will grow to 40 inches into a tank just because its only 3 inches now, it causes long term problems and mis-growth, etc etc, all things you'll hopefully read about.

yeah, im blabbering, and still hungry, so read a lil and ask some more Q's if you have them

And welcome to TFK
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:30 AM   #5
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IamPIRANHA View Post
I was looking into some small cichlids but wasn't sure about compatability among other cichlids or with other fish for that matter. Some have awesome colorations along with unique shapes and sizes. Any cool non-predatory fish to consider? I would like something entertaining. Maybe a chase or odd behaviors. What combination would be most rewarding? Would like multiple species :D. Lol alot to ask for such little to work with .

Thanks!
Cichlids aren't my cup of tea now/maybe ever so my knowledge on them is fairly, well, short of much constructive as i haven't bothered to put the time into the research.
I know convicts are rated as an aggressive fish - though i dont know about diet.
THINK you could do some small/dwarf cichlids in the tank you have but numbers might be fairly limited.

the dwarf puffer is a cool one for odd behaviour - it learns to recognise its owner - inspects every part of its tank constantly (so needs a well planted interesting tank to keep it happy) and when your in front of the tank, will follow you mercilessly, often ''begging'' for food. These dont fit your multiple species idea though as need to be a DP only tank. but they would fit in the lil tank.

People will offer other suggestion on fish with cool behavioural patterns etc, but as im setting one of these tanks up ATM, im all tuned into them

OK....i'm going to cheat now, as i wrote it out yesterday and this is the third time its come up so dont want to repeat- this is a MAJOR point for you to consider though....

What we really need to know in order to properly suggest the correct fish for your community is your water conditions. Fish can't really just go in any tap/well water etc and everybody s water is different. Levels of Kh, carbonate harness, and Gh, general hardness of your water, along with the ph, are very important in determining what fish you can have.

The best thing for determining this is to, if your haven't already, is to ring/google your local water supplier to find out or most display these levels on websites etc.
You could also buy the test kits to determine these yourself.

Once you know these you can determine whether you have soft or hard water etc and therefore determine the fish that are best suited to your water. Trying to do it without knowing these levels can often lead to long term problems with your fish, and can make them quite unhealthy.

Read more: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/f...#ixzz2HTsWyMbI

Last edited by Nilet699; 01-09-2013 at 06:33 AM..
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Old 01-09-2013, 02:38 PM   #6
 
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Nilet is very right when he says we need to know how soft or hard your water is. It will make a difference in what we fish we suggest.

That being said, most fish that can comfortably fit in a 29 gal are small shoaling fish. No strange behaviours or predatory natures. But that doesn't have to make them boring. Tetra (which are closely related to pirahna) are some of the most beautiful fish IMO. Look at some macro photos of their mouths and you'll see that they have a nice set of teeth. They like to use those teeth to hunt down shrimps and daphnia.

But if you are looking for something that is pretty easy to breed on down the line, you should look at the small gourami like honey gourami and dwarf gourami. The male build bubble nests and guard the eggs.
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Old 01-09-2013, 08:07 PM   #7
 
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Agree with what everyone else has had, we need to know your exact water parameters before we can offer stocking suggestions.

In terms of keeping a predatory fish, there is NOTHING which fits the bill for a small tank like that, it is possible to keep a convict cichlid with some small dither fish, the convict though may eat them or kill them. If you want to get into cichlids then you need to be looking at tanks 55g and above, most are active fish requiring the swimming space of a 4ft or longer tank.

Convicts are a great beginner fish as they can literally adapt to almost all water conditions with the exception of very soft and at the other end very hard, anything in between they will be fine.

Keeping a pair of mated convicts is very rewarding as their breeding behavior is extraordinary.

Tank though as mentioned is too small for anything except small shell dweller cichlids but these are far from predatory at all. Sorry but no predatory fish for this tank.
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:40 PM   #8
 
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Another thing I would like to add though - have you ever seen a tetra/rasbora feeding frenzy? They go crazy shredding their flakes and hunting down tubifex worms. It's a lot of fun to watch, and those small fish can be kept comfortably in your tank.

BUT BUT BUT. This all depends on your water, like everyone has said.
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Old 01-11-2013, 07:13 PM   #9
 
Sorry I haven't posted back in awhile.... busy with school and work. Thank you everyone for your postings. Still a bit new to all this. Had a tank when I was about 13 and didn't really bother too much with it and my mom let all the fish die :/ we had tiger barbs and some other cool fish in there. As of right now I have a 10g with a Black Molly and Silver Molly. A Black Kulhi Loach and a few Ghost Shrimp. Got the loach because he looked cool but unfortunatly I rarely see him as he burrows into the gravel :/. Apart from those tanks I have a 2.5g a 5g and a 29g. The 29g has nothing right now infact still has stickers from store on it. the others have equipment but arent in use. I was thinking of sperating the fish into the other 2 (shrimps in the 2.5, others in 5) and using the 10 as a small breeder for guppys and possibly getting a couple small cichlids no bigger than 6in. and some other small compatable fish for the 29g (I was told good rule of thumb is 1in of fish per gallon). I really like some of the aquascapes i've seen using real plants but not sure how to go about that or even what plants to use. I want it to look as natural as possible but be somewhat self sustaining by the "nature" controlling the nitrates and nitrites and all that good stuff. Also thought about a pleco but not sure their compatability with Convicts. I've read on other sites where people were putting like 6-8 cichlids about 4in each in a 29 but that seems a little crowded to me. I wouldn't mind Convict Cichlids and maybe a couple small shoals of fish or would that be a snack for them? The Convicts would be mainly the center piece of the tank. If that ultimatly wouldn't work then what are a few nice stock lists of some fish that would work? Anything I can feed guppies to or possible my mollies after they breed? Also any ideas where I can find some good aquascaping tips and advice and information about the different plants? Come thursday i'll be purchasing the filter for my 29g and heater to start the fishless cycle, should I get an air pump or will some plants provide enough oxygen?

Thanks in advance!
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Old 01-11-2013, 07:43 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IamPIRANHA View Post
Sorry I haven't posted back in awhile.... busy with school and work. Thank you everyone for your postings. Still a bit new to all this. Had a tank when I was about 13 and didn't really bother too much with it and my mom let all the fish die :/ we had tiger barbs and some other cool fish in there. As of right now I have a 10g with a Black Molly and Silver Molly. A Black Kulhi Loach and a few Ghost Shrimp. Got the loach because he looked cool but unfortunatly I rarely see him as he burrows into the gravel :/. Apart from those tanks I have a 2.5g a 5g and a 29g. The 29g has nothing right now infact still has stickers from store on it. the others have equipment but arent in use. I was thinking of sperating the fish into the other 2 (shrimps in the 2.5, others in 5) and using the 10 as a small breeder for guppys and possibly getting a couple small cichlids no bigger than 6in. and some other small compatable fish for the 29g (I was told good rule of thumb is 1in of fish per gallon). I really like some of the aquascapes i've seen using real plants but not sure how to go about that or even what plants to use. I want it to look as natural as possible but be somewhat self sustaining by the "nature" controlling the nitrates and nitrites and all that good stuff. Also thought about a pleco but not sure their compatability with Convicts. I've read on other sites where people were putting like 6-8 cichlids about 4in each in a 29 but that seems a little crowded to me. I wouldn't mind Convict Cichlids and maybe a couple small shoals of fish or would that be a snack for them? The Convicts would be mainly the center piece of the tank. If that ultimatly wouldn't work then what are a few nice stock lists of some fish that would work? Anything I can feed guppies to or possible my mollies after they breed? Also any ideas where I can find some good aquascaping tips and advice and information about the different plants? Come thursday i'll be purchasing the filter for my 29g and heater to start the fishless cycle, should I get an air pump or will some plants provide enough oxygen?

Thanks in advance!
Bad news first... The 10 gallon is to small for the mollies. The 5 gallon would be WAY too small for them. The 29 gallon would actually be a better tank.

The Kuhli hides, because well they do that. It's always recommended to keep them in a group so they are more comfortable and will show themselves. They are very sociable.

A couple cichlids of the type you're looking for just won't work in that small of a tank.

We can't give you any stocking ideas until we find out about your water. Sorry.

The inch per gallon rule is a pretty bad one. There are so many other factors that go into stocking. Whether a species shoals. Whether it is aggressive. How active they are. The inch rule also doesn't take into account mass. 12 one inch fish will not produce anywhere near the same amount of waste as a single 12 inch fish.

You're always going to have to do water changes to get rid of nitrates yourself. You can't just rely on plants to do that for you.

Good news:
Once we find out your parameters people on here can help you with how much to stock.

Plants can be done fairly easily for low light plants. You'd need a new bulb (I'm not sure what brands are good, someone can help with that). You can fertilize with Seachem Flourish once a week. Good plants would be crytpocorynes, anubias, mosses, Java fern, floaters like water sprite, Amazon frogbit, dwarf water lettuce. that's a really quick list. Under the tropical fish profile button up top you can find info about all of these. Or click on the name if it is shaded.

If you get enough plants you can skip over the entire fishless cycle if you stock slowly.
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