new tank syndrome, need help fixing its please - Page 8 - Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources
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post #71 of 86 Old 02-03-2012, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by onemanswarm View Post
I hear you! I suppose it's redundant to keep preaching patience, but I encourage you to take your time and enjoy the aquarium you just got up and running. Over time if you still have the bug, you could upgrade to a larger tank and breed your guppies, using the current tank for fry. Or you could do the community set up you talked about (spend some time researching this in advance). I've learned first hand that Bettas are much more interesting than I'd ever given them credit for. They will NOT get along with guppies unfortunately (a little too similar in appearance it seems), but they can be included in a community set up with carefully researched tankmates. You can also keep a single betta in a small tank, but the experts here will encourage you to give it at least 5g of space and a heater.
I wouldn't otherwise, but as Amy is "thinking" of a Betta, I will interpose.

I do not recommend male Betta with any other fish. In my view, which is shared by many biologists and aquarists, they are not community fish. Not only might the Betta go after other fish, but many "peaceful" fish will turn into real fin nippers when in with a Betta. They deserve their own space, a 5g is fine, well planted.

Yes, they can sometimes work--but it is a risk. I have learned some of my lessons the hard way, and one of these is not to chance a fish that carries the risk of likely trouble. Nine out of ten times, it will result. And the stress to the other fish can be significant.

Byron.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If youíre going to take it under your wing then youíre responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #72 of 86 Old 02-03-2012, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Byron View Post
I wouldn't otherwise, but as Amy is "thinking" of a Betta, I will interpose.

I do not recommend male Betta with any other fish. In my view, which is shared by many biologists and aquarists, they are not community fish. Not only might the Betta go after other fish, but many "peaceful" fish will turn into real fin nippers when in with a Betta. They deserve their own space, a 5g is fine, well planted.

Yes, they can sometimes work--but it is a risk. I have learned some of my lessons the hard way, and one of these is not to chance a fish that carries the risk of likely trouble. Nine out of ten times, it will result. And the stress to the other fish can be significant.

Byron.
Amy, please listen to Byron and not to me!

Byron, I appreciate the interposition although it does put a serious damper on my plans to eventually add a shoal of tetras into the present mix! Your advice will not be taken lightly, yet it does run contrary to the opinions of many vocal contributors in the Betta forum where I originally sought insights on this topic. I feel compelled to bump some month old threads over there and have a quick word with them.

BTW, please don't ever hesitate to interject if you catch me spreading dubious information in the forum. I'm here for the education first and foremost.


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Last edited by onemanswarm; 02-03-2012 at 11:13 PM.
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post #73 of 86 Old 02-04-2012, 12:27 AM
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Wow! That was really awesome, onemanswarm! That made me smile. I love it when we can be polite, intelligent people on forums.
As opinionated and outspoken as I am, I hope I can humbly accept when I am wrong just as much as I hope that, when I'm 'right', I'm understood not as being 'right' but, most importantly, as being helpful and having good intentions. My goals on this forum, both of equal importance, are to learn and to help all beings be at ease.



Group hug?

"My dither fish need dither fish!"
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post #74 of 86 Old 02-04-2012, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by amy11 View Post
its been tough but well worth it, i love seeing the little guys swimming around and having fun, however i now have the fish bug and want to get another, possibly larger tank, also thinking of buying a betta, ive read so many great reviews about them, or maybe create a larger community tank, so many choices !

Amy,

I added a female betta to my community tank, really because her eyes were so soulful when I saw her in a cup at PetCo. At first I never even saw her in the tank. She was obviously intimated by the more active fish, but I do have lots of plants and hiding spots. After about 2 weeks, she is always out and is doing great. I don't know about females with guppies though. I have to agree with other posts, they are more interesting than I thought too, but I tell myself, no more. One is fine

Look for a small 5 gal on Craigslist and keep a male by himself if you want a male. If your patient, you'll find a set up ready to go, that you can get to cheap.

Gwen

Just because animals can't talk, does not mean they should not be heard
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post #75 of 86 Old 02-04-2012, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by MinaMinaMina View Post
Wow! That was really awesome, onemanswarm! That made me smile. I love it when we can be polite, intelligent people on forums.
As opinionated and outspoken as I am, I hope I can humbly accept when I am wrong just as much as I hope that, when I'm 'right', I'm understood not as being 'right' but, most importantly, as being helpful and having good intentions. My goals on this forum, both of equal importance, are to learn and to help all beings be at ease.



Group hug?
Very well said! I fear I'm guilty of trying to partake in the latter without first sufficiently partaking in the former!


My 2-year-old son asked Santa for "a red fishy." Now Daddy's got a new obsession!
43-second Tank Tribute (With Disney Soundtrack!)
Aquarium Log

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post #76 of 86 Old 02-04-2012, 10:36 AM
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Gwen mentions a female Betta, that is a very different thing. In my earlier post i said no male Betta with other fish. Male Betta, or Siamese Fighting Fish, are bred to be nasty. I did have a male Betta many years ago, and he ate neon tetra voraciously.

I stay out of the Betta forum since I have no interest in that fish plus all the time I have is spent here. But when you get some action on this issue, let me know and I'll take a look.

I don't know how many biologists are over there, but I have several behind my views and here's an example. I posted this article a while back, on the 10 worst community fish, from Practical Fishkeeping; the male Betta is included.
The 10 worst community fish of all time | Blog | Practical Fishkeeping

There was a similar-themed article in TFH back it would take me some time to track it down. My friend, Matt Ford, a UK biologist and owner of Seriously Fish, says, "There is some debate as to whether the species makes a good community fish or not. In general, we think it's best suited to a species tank."
Siamese fighting fish (Betta splendens) - Seriously Fish

As with most fish, there are always exceptions to the norm. But to me the best approach is to accept the norm as the most probable. If one has a room of a dozen fish tanks, and wants to experiment with fish, that may work as there will be space to move problem fish. But for most hobbyists on TFK, with just one community tank, setting themselves up for a problem is not wise. The fish will be the losers.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If youíre going to take it under your wing then youíre responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #77 of 86 Old 02-04-2012, 05:16 PM Thread Starter
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i would not add a betta to a community tank as ive read they can find fish with long fins(such as guppies) a threat, i would keep it seperately,also i have some bad news ive lost yet another guppy, he was one of the first into my tank and all others seem fine and are eating and lively, im beginning to loose the will to live as all my water perameters are fine and the temp is correct, help? and i havent yet worked out what the brown stuff is, its on my decor and gravel

We guppies
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post #78 of 86 Old 02-05-2012, 11:44 AM
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ive lost yet another Guppy, he was one of the first into my tank and all others seem fine and are eating and lively, im beginning to loose the will to live as all my water perameters are fine and the temp is correct, help? and i havent yet worked out what the brown stuff is, its on my decor and gravel
Amy, I think this was answered by me and probably others in another thread? Try not to duplicate issues in two or more threads, because it makes it difficult for people like me to keep it all straight in my mind.

If not, let me know and I'll respond.

Byron.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If youíre going to take it under your wing then youíre responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #79 of 86 Old 02-06-2012, 11:42 AM
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Amy,

Below are Byron's responses to your questions as they appear earlier in the thread. Bottom line, the loss of those two fish is not that surprising since they undoubtedly took a heavy toll from the cycling process. I'd expect the new batch of fish to fare much better. The brown stuff is not unusual either. Byron details some of the usual suspects for you below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Byron View Post
Difficult to say amy. If this was one of the original fish, the cycling issues could have affected it; fish sometimes appear to survive cycling, but it takes a toll and down the road... . Of it can be the fish, who can tell what issues it may have suffered getting here, or what may be naturally inherent (genetic)?
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Originally Posted by Byron View Post
Probably diatoms, or brown algae as it is commonly called. This is very common in new tanks, during the first 3 or so months as the bacteria/biology has not yet stabilized. If it occurs on plant leaves, you should clean it off (it will easily rub off with your fingers during a water change). On the decor is up to you. Sometimes it will appear on the glass too, an aquarium sponge scraper run over the front glass every water change is a good idea to keep this and other algae from getting started on the glass. This type is easy to remove, but some, like green dot, is more difficult so it is best to catch it before you actually see it.

It could also just be a biofilm. All object under water will develop a biofilm on which bacteria colonize, and algae too in some cases. You won't see the biofilm on plants (unless it attracts algae), but on decor it does usually appear sort of brownish. This will not rub off easily, and I would leave it.

Byron.


My 2-year-old son asked Santa for "a red fishy." Now Daddy's got a new obsession!
43-second Tank Tribute (With Disney Soundtrack!)
Aquarium Log

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post #80 of 86 Old 02-22-2012, 10:40 AM Thread Starter
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hey guys sorry ive been off for while but lifes hectic, the brown stuff is spreading so im assuming its algae its on everything, my filter, glass, gravel etc, when i did a water change i wiped some off easy enough but it came back, how do i get rid of it?

We guppies
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