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new tank advice please

5K views 32 replies 5 participants last post by  1stAquarium 
#1 ·
Ok, so im just in the process of cleaning out a 20 litre tank which has been used in the past for a goldfish but that didnt go to well... so im moving onto tropical in the hope that the smaller fish will be much more suited to this tank? i plan to get some neon tetras or something similar in size.

so im just in the process of cleaning the tank out and cleaning the gravel, ive also been given an old filter of a friend as the one that came with this tank i feel is useless.

now im just not sure of how to cycle the tank best... im planning on adding clean tap water, adding some tetra aquasafe to dechlorinate it, and its here where im not to sure...

ive just been to my lfs and picked up an adequate heater (25w is ok for 20 litres right?) and also got a small plant and some tetra safe start. is the safe start worth using? as some people say it works great and will do just as good a job as a normal cycle using ammonia etc, and other people are telling me its a waste of time?

also once the tank is set up and i eventually get it set up with the right test results and have fish in it, how often should i be doing water changes? i dont want to overkill the waterchanges and do more harm than good?

thanks for reading..and any advice

regards
martin
 
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#2 ·
Hello & Welcome to the forum,

for those thinking in gallon its a 5g :)

Yes its a smart choice to house something very small in there not goldfish. Different fish have different needs on size of tank as well as softness or hardness of water. For example your Neon's will thrive on water that's soft. If you're unsure what water you have, you can take a sample to your fish sore. Or you can buy yourself a test kit which you'd also later on need during cycling the tank and/ or maintenance. A well sorted liquid test kit (such as offered by API) should incl pH, Hardness, NO2, NO3, Ammonia.

You're cleaning it with water only I guess, no chemicals?
Assuming you will not have this tank placed in a icy cold basement room, yes this heater will be working for you.

I honestly can not help you on the Safe Start, while Tetra does make very good products, I pers always cycled my tanks fish less, fed the tanks daily with flaks...nothing added.

Once you have everything set up the way you like, I strongly recommend reading over this real quick before you go out buying fish http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/freshwater-aquariums/aquarium-cycle-252/
Once a tank is established its desirable to do a water exchange once a week at around 30-40% of the volume of your tank. Any fresh water from you tap should be treated with Conditioner before adding to the tank to remove metals and ammonia etc from your tap water.

Hope this helps for the moment, otherwise come back with a list of more questions please :)
 
#3 ·
Hello & Welcome to the forum,

for those thinking in gallon its a 5g :)

Yes its a smart choice to house something very small in there not goldfish. Different fish have different needs on size of tank as well as softness or hardness of water. For example your Neon's will thrive on water that's soft. If you're unsure what water you have, you can take a sample to your fish sore. Or you can buy yourself a test kit which you'd also later on need during cycling the tank and/ or maintenance. A well sorted liquid test kit (such as offered by API) should incl pH, Hardness, NO2, NO3, Ammonia.

You're cleaning it with water only I guess, no chemicals?
Assuming you will not have this tank placed in a icy cold basement room, yes this heater will be working for you.

I honestly can not help you on the Safe Start, while Tetra does make very good products, I pers always cycled my tanks fish less, fed the tanks daily with flaks...nothing added.

Once you have everything set up the way you like, I strongly recommend reading over this real quick before you go out buying fish http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/freshwater-aquariums/aquarium-cycle-252/
Once a tank is established its desirable to do a water exchange once a week at around 30-40% of the volume of your tank. Any fresh water from you tap should be treated with Conditioner before adding to the tank to remove metals and ammonia etc from your tap water.

Hope this helps for the moment, otherwise come back with a list of more questions please :)

thanks thats a great help, and yeah ive just cleaned the tank and only used water and a soft sponge to just wipe it and ive cleaned all the gravel and im just about to put that back in.

so i guess if i put the heater and filter in now and get them turned on along with putting the plant in and treat the water using some conditioner (i have tetra aquasafe...) i should be ok for now? im not planning on getting any fish for a week yet so i dont want to put the safestart stuff in to early although i cant see how it can do any harm?
 
#4 ·
Yup you got it all sorted :) You don't even need us here I think lol
Just put it all together, hook everything up the way you like it and done. I use Tetra Aquasafe as well (have for many many yrs).

So you wanna cycle with fish? Just be warned Tetra's are VERY sensitive fish and the peaks of Ammonia and Nitrate that you will encounter while cycling this tank may easily result on them dieing on you that's why I do fishless cycles). The more it is important IMO that you'd get a liquid test kit, so you can test your tank water every day for the first few weeks, so if anything rises you can do a water exchange immediately.
 
#5 ·
well i was hoping to get the leves to an acceptable level by using the safe start but im not sure as to whats the best course of action.. im not hell bent on getting neon tetras straight away anyway...

someone said that danios are a bit of a hardier fish so maybe a better choice? so maybe one or 2 of them, and if they make it which im hoping they would maybe also add 2 or 3 neons to see how things develop?
 
#6 ·
Oh and as for the test kit, i currently have an api ammonia kit which is a water test kit, but my other results come from strips, but i have just ordered an api master test kit off ebay so hopefully this will give better results, just a case of waiting for it to arrive.
 
#7 ·
Danios are harder fish in comparison to Neon Tetra, that is true. That said they're also incredible active swimmers and being a 5g there's really not a lot room for them to be active.

Yes absolutely, the Liquid kit will bring you accurate results, while as the strips are not only inacurate, but by the time they actually show you NO's & Ammonia on the stips, its often too late for the fish, so that will be a incredible help to you.
When you tank is set up, feed it as if there were fish in it with flakes every day, few flakes, that will feed Ammonia & NO's and help get your tank cycled w/out fish. This process can take anywhere from few days to 2-3 weeks, in my tanks its usually around 8-10 days from start till I see NO's & Ammnia rise & fall.
 
#9 ·
Thanks for the welcome :)

think ill stay away from danio's then!
i do have some fish flakes handy so i can put some in now, should i wait a to let any ammonia this may cause build up before i add the safe start?

i was also considering possibly a betta.. but i dont want to get one of these and end up being unable to get a couple of neons along side it eventually incase of them being eaten or anything? lol

on another note, the heater is now set up and running, and set to heat the water to around 26c ,it is a 25w heater,,, but im worried cos im in a pretty cold room at the moment... so thinking maybe i would of been better with a 50w heater.. how long should it take before the water reaches the right temp?
 
#12 ·
also ive just noticed 2 very small snails.. now i had these before and thought i may of gotten rid since cleaning but i guess not.... anyway i dont actually mind them being in the tank as they help cleaning? but will they cause any problems? and would snails add to much to the "load" of the tank?
 
#13 ·
No need to say sorry for asking good questions here! :)
With the fish you have in mind, i'd really suggest keep measuring your water every day when you get your kit, one day ammonia will rise (and then the NO's will follow) and then fall again (which may happen in 1 week like you wish, but it may take a few days longer), after that point is when I'd add fish in there, preferably I'd start with the Betta and then another week later the Neons. That's really the safest approach to avoid loosing any one.
Snails are EXCELLENT lil helpers in tanks to keep it clean with you, so pers I prefer having some in all of my tanks, so clearly my vote goes: Keep them :)
And no they can not cause no problems neither to live plants (if you wanna have some) nor the fish.
 
#14 ·
ahh great, well here is how it is set up at the moment, i am gonna probably buy a little hiding place tommorow, and maybe another plant. just waiting on a digital thermometer and the api test kit to arrive now

i did test the ammonia earlier and it looks like its around 0.25 but this is the same as it comes out of my tap so im not sure if its an innacurate reading or not. im still unsure as to go with a betta or not as i dont want my filter causing to much water flow for it? ill make my mind up eventually!
 

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#15 ·
0.25 Ammonia is, in parts of our country, not uncommon out of the tap. which doesn't make it any better thou. Therefore make sure reading your current conditioner box if it does detoxify Ammonia. If your conditioner does not do it I strongly suggest getting something like Prime otherwise you're gonna wind up permanently exposing your fish to toxic ammonia from the tap - I don't need to tell you what the longer term effects on that would be.
 
#17 ·
*walk to the guest bathrm and back* .... "Removes or neutralizes Chlorine, heavy metals eg copper, zinc, iron; enhances natural slime coat on fish"...

So no it ain't removing ammonia, which in yor case having 0.25 in the tap water is really really not good, so before buying yourself any fish at any stage along the way I really urge you to buy any Conditioner that will also neutralizes ammonia to its non toxic form treat your water wit it all the time.
 
#19 ·
... my guests get in the way of my 'fish-bathrom' as my hubby refers to it... thank godness the holidays are OVER and summer break for all nephews and cousins and any other stray kid accumulating at my house is a while to go still lol
 
#20 ·
yeah i think ill get some of the seachems prime as you suggested, going to the lfs later anyway so ill see if they have it in there, if not ill get either something similar or ebay it...

i guess why my tank is cyclying at the moment its not exactly a disaster that their is ammonia in there already as this is needed anyway?
 
#21 ·
Your store should have this product, or similar one's.
I have a super hard time here to get anything period, so this is the page I get all my supply's from Aquarium Supplies | Pet Solutions
Nop all going good there for ya.
 
#22 ·
ahhh thanks for the site, im in the uk tho so i can't use it, i have got some prime on its way anyway :)

ive just had a thought and not sure if it will make a difference... the filter that is currently being used in my tank was old of a friend and the filter media was dirty and i didnt change it, will this really matter?

anyway thanks for sticking with me angel, your a star!
 
#23 ·
Oh I'm sorry I didn't know that. Thou I went to school there, I donno any fish places there lol

How long was that filter w/out water on the air to dry? If it was kept wet, its actually totally awesome to have the 'dirty' filter cause that's all your necessary beneficial bacteria right there. If it was on the air w/out water for few days, they died off tho then yu'll starrt from 0 and cycled the tank as it is was a normal new set up.

You're very welcome - Any time :)
 
#24 ·
im pretty sure it was dry and hadn't been used for a while which is to bad really, i was thinking of asking the friend if he can give me either some rocks or a bit of filter media or something to help my tank aswell.. but hes got coldwater fish, would that make a difference?
 
#25 ·
Hey, your tank set up looks really nice! I have a male betta and 5 neons in different tanks, both absolutely gorgeous fish, you're in for a treat! I didn't realise they could actually live together, I may put my neons in with the betta in his 30 litre tank. :)
As for cycling, sounds like you're doing great, when I cycled my first tank I put a bag of gravel from my coldwater tank at the bottom of my new filter, not sure how much it helped though. Any chance you could get some filter media (small cut offs from sponges etc) from your friend to add to your filter?
 
#27 ·
im gonna ask him and see if he will but i doubt hell get round to it :lol: just done another test n the ammonia doesnt seem to be rising yet but all ive done is add a bit of fish food, im not sure whether or not to give the rotting prawn method a try
 
#26 ·
If he can get you piece of sponge to add to yours that'll sure do it for bacteria, just ask him to put it in a wet bag till he gets to your place and then add to the filter right away.
 
#29 ·
Just give it few days.
With all you've done from you other tank, used filters yaddy ya....There may never be a peak ceuase there's enough BB in there already. I'd at least give it 10 days, test each day if anything rises.
 
#30 ·
Ok so the prime has turned up :)

now ive noticed over the last few days my ammonia level doesnt seem to have risen at all, so i think im gonna go to the local diy store n get some pure ammonia and try things this way and see how things go, i guess theres no point adding any prime until ive seen an ammonia and nitrite spike? and leave it till i do the water change before adding the new fish?
 
#31 ·
Cross check the bottle, but as far as I know (not having this product at home) Prime removes ammonia, or better said it devolves it into another version of non-toxic stuff. Not sure casue I don't have it, but that could be why its screwing with your parameters?!
 
#32 · (Edited)
well i havent used any of the prime yet, anyway i got some household ammonia and added a little bit so ill do my next tests n see if it has risen, and then take it from there

edit just tested for ammonia and its gone through the rood, like towards 8.0, i only added the tiniest amount! lol, so add some bacteria stuff or just leave it to its own devices?
 
#33 ·
I have never seen any ammonia at all in my tanks, I have used stress zyme and tried to seed the tank with bacteria etc. Is this unusual? I have a proper testing kit with the liquids and test tubes and have tested positive for everythig else. Maybe your tank is already in the nitrite/nitrate stages and doesn't need the ammonia as Angel says.
 
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