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First tank (19G) help!

4K views 29 replies 8 participants last post by  iamntbatman 
#1 ·
I just picked up a 12/13 gallon tank the other week and filled it with some clean filtered water from Culligan, got the heater, filters, and everything up and running for 2 days. I bought some plant and added them 1 day into it. After 2 days I decided to add some "hardy" fish. I added 2- 1.75" tiger barbs (one male, one female), 2-Gouramis 1.5" (one blue, one gold). Everything seemed ok at firts the Gouramis were very skitish and the Barbs chased eachother. After the first night the chasing became very one sided and the larger male tiger barb has been constantly chasing an nipping at the female for 3 days. The Gourami's are left alone by the barbs and seem to get a long with everyone. A little mayhem, but no big problems....

1. Yesterday, day 2 of being in the tank, I noticed the male TB flashing at the plants, rocks, othe objects, and rubbing the glass walls. He still continues to chase the female, but when she is hiding or he loses interest (rare) he is flashing. What do you think is going on here? I got all the fish from fresh shipment at Petco.

2. The female Tiger Barb hasn't eaten for the past 2 days and spends all her time hiding and floating at a 45* downward angle. What should I do about this issue?

I added a spotted cory cat to hopefully clean up the left over food at the bottom of the tank last night. I just did a vacuum of the rocks and 25% water change.
Additives used: API stress coat, Nova aqua & AmQuel (only on intial setup), Top Fin bacteria supplement (last night).
Food: Tetra color.
Water: Initial- NO3-0, NO2-O, pH-6, Alk-0, TH-0 (ppm)
Current- NO3-20, NO2-O, pH-6, Alk-0, TH-0 (ppm)

Any help advice very much appreciated!
 
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#2 ·
There are a ton of mistakes here.

1) Fish added during cycle.
2) Tank never gone through cycle/still going
3) Only Two Tiger Barbs
4) Two Gouramis
5) One Cory

As to your questions...

1) The barbs are stressed like no other. You have to have groups of at least 8, preferably 10. They will never, ever get along in groups smaller than that. Your barb is freaking out because of the lack of group members.
2) The female will likely die. Sorry to sound rude, but I experienced the exact thing with a group of 7 Tigers. The dominant picks on the weakest, until the barb starts floating, not eating, etc.

Solutions.

Take all the fish back to where you got them. A 13G tank will not be able to hold ten Tigers.
You also need to have at very minimum, 4 cories. 6 is better.
You should only have one gourami per tank, because they are very territorial.
After the fish are gone, do a proper cycle.
 
#3 ·
Did I read that right? How is there already 20ppm of nitrAte on day 2? In the parameters why isn't there a reading for NH3/NH4? It is hard for me to believe that there wouldn't be any ammonia with a new bioload that large. My guess is that you are using ammo-lock and test strips which are inaccurate. The ammo-lock will just make the reading further off. That is just me guessing though.... but what do I know, I'm a newb 2.
 
#5 ·
Those numbers look like they came from a paper test strip. They're better than nothing, but still notoriously inaccurate. Also, they'll cost a heck of a lot more than a liquid kit in the long run and lack an ammonia test. Get yourself a good liquid test kit like the API Freshwater Master Test Kit. It costs something like $35 at Petco but can be found for half that price at online stores like Aquariumguys and Drs. Foster and Smith.

I somewhat agree with Cody's recommendations. The blue and gold gouramis will not get along with one another, and are too big for your tank. They may not be fighting now, but once the tank is cycled and they aren't stressed out anymore, they'll start fighting. I would return them.

What are the dimensions of your tank? 13/14 gallons is a very odd size so it's not a standard shaped tank. However, if it's at least 24" long, I'd say that's probably alright for tiger barbs. I own tigers - I initially had five, and the fighting was relentless, so I added just one more and the problem was solved. A year or so later, one of the pack died from a fungal infection, and the remaining five barbs did just fine. I recently added two more to bring the number up to seven, but it really wasn't necessary. Odds are, small numbers of barbs (especially two, like you've got) will result in bullying and eventually death, and it's very likely that increasing their numbers will fix this problem. I think you could get away with six or seven tigers in your tank, provided it's long enough to give them adequate swimming room. As Cody suggested, I would get your corydoras catfish some friends as these are also schooling fish.

So, here's what I'd do:
1) A 50% water change ASAP since you aren't 100% sure of your water parameters.
2) Order a liquid test kit online.
3) Take the gouramis and one of the barbs back to the store, along with a water sample so that they can give you good numbers while you wait for your test kit to arrive.
4) Do 50% water changes daily until your test kit arrives.
5) Continue to cycle the tank by monitoring the water parameters with the new test kit and do water changes whenever needed (i.e. whenever ammonia or nitrite are detectable).
6) After the tank has cycled and your parameters are good for a week or so, slowly add more barbs and cories. I would say two fish a week would allow your bacteria colonies to grow in order to handle the increasing bioload.
7) Watch for problems with the barbs. Return problem fish if you need to.
 
#6 ·
First off thanks so much for the help. You guys rock!

Tank is a weird size it held right around 13 gallons full to the top. It's dimensions are 20" W, 19" H, 10" D. If I want to have this be a community tank at this size are tiger barbs pretty much out of the picture? If so I will take both back along with the Gouramis, keep the Cory and cycle the tank while monitoring with a good test kit. If you think I can do a community tank with barbs then I will keep the fiesty one.

Also any suggestions of what fish to stock this community tank with that are brightly colored and unique looking, and fun to watch would be much appreciated. I do really like the way the dwarf Gourami looks. Maybe a tank with a couple of these with some smaller roomates.
 
#7 ·
Hmm with only 20" of swimming space, I'm not sure I would try the tiger barbs.

I would go for a stocking list like this:
5 or 6 cories (all the same species)
1 dwarf gourami (like the bigger gouramis, they're aggressive toward their own kind so only one should be kept in a smaller tank like yours)
6-8 small schooling fish, like neons, cardinal tetras, black neons, ember flame tetras, bloodfin tetras, harlequin rasboras or even threadfin rainbows.

Some would say that's a heavy stocking list. It is heavy, but not overstocked, and with your two types of filtration you should be just fine provided you're good about doing your weekly water changes once the tank is established.
 
#9 ·
Right on! I will return the tiger barbs and gouramis tomorrow and just roll with the single cory for now. Great suggestions of fish above. I will have to look into those species as most are new to me.

I am going to setup a 30 gallon once i build a cabinet, hopefully this week. I was thinking of going with Cichlids in the 30 gallon. How would a school of tiger barbs do with the cichlids?
 
#10 ·
Depends on the cichlid. It's sort of a balancing act - tiger barbs can be nippy and intimidating, so you'll want something that isn't going to get bossed around by them, but you don't want something really aggressive or it may kill them. I have a single jewel cichlid housed with tiger barbs in a 20g right now and it has been working pretty well. The jewel dislikes them and will give chase from time to time, but it keeps them schooling nicely and on their best behavior. Something as docile as a keyhole cichlid might get bossed around, though, and something mean like a convict or salvini might kill the barbs.
 
#12 ·
I've never tried that mix myself, but you'd have to be careful for sure. The barbs might really try to snag some of the fry and krib parents can be *very* aggressive about defending their fry.

Kribs aren't exactly the rarest of fish, but they're not livebearers, either. With that in mind, you should have no problems finding a store that will take them off your hands, but they may not give you very much for them (or anything at all). For example, I traded a batch of 34 1.5" kribensis fry to a store for a $13 container of flake food. I wasn't looking to make a profit - I just wanted the fry out of my tank.
 
#13 ·
I picked up the API full test kit today and pH tested good 7.4, Ammonia....... 1.0ppm YIKES! I got some bags from Petco when I picked up the kit. So back to the store the tiger barbs and gourami go. I will do a 50% water change and let the tank cycle with the lone cory cat. The stick on ammonia meter didn't work for beans.
 
#15 ·
Sounds like your on the right track. Just be sure that the ammonia levels stay down (not reaching higher than .5ppm if you can) since you already have a cory in there. I normally say to just let your tank run once you get ammonia, but since you already have a cory, I would be doing Water changes every day to be safe.
 
#16 ·
You are going to be controlling ammonia at lower than 0.5 ppm for now but as soon as that seems to be taking care of itself you will start seeing nitrites. Nitrites are also toxic and need to be kept at less than 0.25 ppm by again doing large water changes. Only when both ammonia and nitrites start taking care of themselves should you think about any fish besides what you already have.
If you lose the cory, which is entirely possible, do not replace him with any fish. Instead get some pure ammonia and finish cycling by adding about 1/2 teaspoon to your tank to obtain ammonia at around 5 ppm and monitoring daily to make sure the ammonia returns to zero. If your cycle has progressed at all, it will quickly drop the ammonia to zero on its own and you will need to add more ammonia the next day. The ammonia will convert into nitrites so you will monitor those also until ammonia and nitrites are both at zero within less than 24 hours. When both ammonia and nitrites are being processed by the bacteria in your filter, you could then do a 90% or more water change to get your nitrates back under 40 ppm and be ready to add your first fish.
 
#17 ·
Cory is still livin happily. Water condition update.

12/24 NH3-1.0-1.5ppm NO2-.25 NO3-7.0
30% water change

12/27 NH3-1.0ppm NO2-0.5-1.0 NO3-7.0
30% water change

12/30 NH3-0.5ppm NO2-1.5 NO3-7.0
20% water change
 
#18 ·
Update: Please Help! Advice needed

1/2 NH3-0.25ppm NO2-5.0 NO3-7.0
30% water change

1/7 NH3-0ppm NO2-2.0 NO3-10
No water change

1/13 NH3-0ppm NO2-5.0 NO3-10


I cut back on the feedin and I am only feeding 1/3 an algae sink pellet ever 3 days. What should I do next. I do have plants in the tank are they slowing down this process???
 
#19 ·
It's not a quick process but your tank is moving along, don't worry. Just keep on changing the water to keep nitrites below 0.5ppm, 0.25ppm if possible.

I'd look into getting some sinking shrimp pellets or something with some protein in it, corys are scavengers, not herbivores.
 
#20 ·
10-4 I will pickup some shirmp pellets today. I was watching the cory eat and he is a very messy eater. This is probably contributing to my high nitrites. Thanks for the advice
 
#21 ·
No problem, I've found I love the little catfish. I wouldn't worry about the mess too much, as the lone fish in the tank its unlikely he can finish even the little food you're offering him. Once more fish go in the tank, including some more corys, the mess won't be as bad.
 
#22 ·
1/16 NH3-0ppm NO2-5.0 NO3-7
No water change

1/18 NH3-0ppm NO2-1.0 NO3-5

1/20 NH3-0ppm NO2-0.25-0.5 NO3-5

Am I there yet or do I need to wait a little longer???????????
 
#23 ·
You're not there yet. A cycled tank has 0 ppm ammonia, 0 ppm nitrite, and nitrate > 0. I'd wait for the cycle to finish before adding anything new. Once you're cycled your tank will be in very good shape for the fish, until it is you're going to be on a razors edge the whole time. The good news is the cycle should be finished soon.
 
#24 ·
Ok... Patiently!!! waiting. lol

Should I keep changing water at this point or let it balance intself out? If so, what % water change do you reccommend?
 
#25 ·
Keep changing it. You've got fish in there and you need to watch out for their health. Nitrite is as dangerous as ammonia for them.

What % is really something only you can answer. Once the tank is cycled you want to change enough so that your nitrates don't rise above 40ppm. Changing more isn't a problem. Better to change water than not to change. Personally on both my tanks I change 30% a week. This is overkill as I've never seen over 10ppm nitrates in my 48 gallon or in my Eclipse. It's a good number for me on both counts as that's pretty close to how much I pull out just vacuuming the tanks. I wouldn't change more than 50% at a time though. If you need more than that change it more often.
 
#26 ·
I just tested the water (1/23) and 0ppm across the board!!!!!

I am thinking of getting a school of small fish tomorrow to add to the tank. I like the cory, but I don't think I am going to add any more, unless it becomes an issue.

Possible tank stock: (open to suggestio)
1 cory cat
5-6 red eye tetras, cardinal tetras, neon tetras, red zebra danios (if I can find them, supposed to glow in the dark!)
1-3 larger fish that are cool looking??????? would some angel fish fit in??
 
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