Amazon Tank?
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Amazon Tank?

This is a discussion on Amazon Tank? within the Beginner Freshwater Aquarium forums, part of the Freshwater Fish and Aquariums category; --> Okay I currently have threee 55g tanks. 2 are being used by turtles and one is empty. Iam thinking of setting up an amazon ...

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Old 09-11-2010, 11:31 PM   #1
 
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Amazon Tank?

Okay I currently have threee 55g tanks. 2 are being used by turtles and one is empty. Iam thinking of setting up an amazon style tank(though some specimens won tbe from there).
I have two 405 fluval canisters. I also have a hang on the back thats supposed to be good, but Iam upgrading it to the highest hang on back filter that you guys recommend(I need help with that). so if you could recommend me a hang on back filter thatd be great.
But here is what I have. I have sand(small grained), I have a fluval heater(supposed to be the most accurate heater.)

I have some "cichlid salts and minerals" and some powder product called "cichlid salt".

I know an angel fish is a cichlid of a sort. Which is what I want to add to my tank. Here is what Id like:
-2 Sex paired angel fish(one black, and one natural or one blushing and one black. Idk yet. Probably natural one and black though).
-6 to 12 cory cats(clean up crew)
- 10 to 20 neons
- 2 to 3 snails
-2 razor back musk turtles(they're clean and like deeper waters).

I may upgrade to a 75g, but I think the bioload should be enough since the other tanks have "messy" turtles in there and its still pretty clean. Only thing is I want to take the phosphates out since this may harm the shells of the turtle. The temps I want em to run up to 72 or 82(Higher temps are better imo)
I have 4 air pumps that are rated each for 100gallons. So yeah.
I want to use live plants in this tank mixed in with some fakes but Id love to have:
-Duckweed(I want something that floats. So if not duckweed recommend me other plants that are durable. I want clean plants. No mess you know like getting stuck to filters).
-Amazon swords
-Anubias
-Baby's tears
-Moss balls(Idk I just like their looks).

Basically long leafed plants for the back and middle range plants for the middle and things that cover the ground for the front. I know petco sells babys tears and alot of assorted plants.

Id like tips on what is the best place to buy fish. I can buy online so that is good. I probably asked this a long time ago but basically no one even replied to it. So Iam hoping people will take a gander at it and reply.
Though Iam thinking of getting the turtles first and then wait till I get a 75g to set up the fish. In any case here are the types of turtles Iam thinking of(though Iam only going for ONE pair of the following):
-A pair of razor backs( sternotherus carionatus- I love their spots and they love deep water)
-A pair of 3 stripped mud turtles(kinostern-they stay pretty small 3inches) and they have really nice colors.
-A pair of common musk turtles(sternotherus odoratus)

As for non- muds or musks. I also have in mind of:
Texas map turtle(males stay 3inches).


Again Iam only thinking 1 pair of turtles(females possibly), 1 sex paired of angel fish(id love to get them atleast around 3-4inches big already).
-A small group of neon tetras or any fish that comes from the amazons and would do well in a planted tank.
-A small group of corydoras
I was thinking instead of the snails Id get 1 shovel nose catfish(the one that is extremely thin and is brown colored and has a long nose. Its body is very long and thin).




I am also wanting to know opinion on which are the best hang on the back filters.

Also how do you keep water plants alive? I keep getting told alot of stuff. I did manage to find for sale a few plant C02 diffusers and "plant foods" Idk if thats needed. Please bear in mind I only keep goldfish in a 75g(a trio). So I dont remember much about other fish. As for fish foods I am thinking of feeding them:
Flakes(Idk what brand yet)
Crushed krill
Sinking pellets for the cories(Id get two kinds.. Carnivore pellets and spirulina waffers)
Plankton(freezedried)
and sometimes Id give live insects but id freeze or boil the insects first prior to killing parasites.

Or I could give it the diet Iam aiming to give my turtles which is something called "Gelatin suspensions" which contains:
-30% mollusks(snails and clams)
-15%crustaceans(crayfish, shrimps)
-20%Insects(crickets, earthworms, waxworms, pheonix worms, etc)
-20% Whole fish(freshwater fish of course)
-15% Veggies and fruit(kale, apple, carrots, squash, and whatever I can find that doesnt contain enzymes).

Then Id mix it in with vitamin powder(3scoops) then calcium with D3(3scoops-tbsp)
1Cuttle bone for grit and crunch. Then id put it on the blender and liquify it. Then Id mix it with flavorless, tastless gelatin and put it in the freezer. As for the fish, mollusks and insects Id boil them for 5minutes. Or I could just put the mix in a pot and boil it for 5mins while stirring and mixing another scoop of vitamins and calcium(boiling eats away those or so my parents said). So then id have a home made meal for the turtle and the fish is that good for the fish?
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Old 09-12-2010, 11:26 AM   #2
 
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15 people look at this and nobody can really help me with this? :/ Whats up with this, every time I make a thread I never get a response.
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Old 09-12-2010, 12:04 PM   #3
 
Ok i have some opinions about this,



1.Neons will get eaten by Angelfish.
2.The Fluval 405's should be more than adequate for your purpose.
3.The more Cories the better (i suggest the 12)
4. I also own Turtle and i think that the angelfishes longer fins would get eaten.
5.Duckweed is fine
6.I suggest 6 - 8 snails although they will breed,and cause the bioload to raise, the 2 fluvals with take care of that perfectly.


Thats pretty much all i can answer.if you need anything just ask.
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Old 09-12-2010, 06:54 PM   #4
 
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Well, one reason for few replies are the number of issues crammed into one post, and many of them are complete topics in themselves. I'll just touch on a couple general things.

Filtration in an Amazon tank with the majority of fish you mention (leaving the turtles out for the present) should be minimal. These are forest fish that live in flooded forest half the year and in slow-moving creeks and streams the other half. They do not like, nor do they do well (health-wise) in strong currents. So in a 55g planted Amazon tank, one canister filter is sufficient.

You might want to check the photos of my Amazonian setups; my 115g Amazon Riverscape and 90g flooded Amazon forest in particular. These illustrate what I mean by forest fish, plants, minimal filtration, low light. There is the series "A Basic Approach to the Natural Planted Aquarium" at the top of the Aquarium Plants section you should read through for background, as all that applies to the fish and plants you want.

For fish mixes, have a look at the species in our Tropical Fish Profiles, second tab from the left in the blue bar at the top; or click on shaded names in posts to see that fish/plant profile.

This is for starters.

Byron.
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Old 09-12-2010, 09:44 PM   #5
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Byron View Post
Well, one reason for few replies are the number of issues crammed into one post, and many of them are complete topics in themselves. I'll just touch on a couple general things.

Filtration in an Amazon tank with the majority of fish you mention (leaving the turtles out for the present) should be minimal. These are forest fish that live in flooded forest half the year and in slow-moving creeks and streams the other half. They do not like, nor do they do well (health-wise) in strong currents. So in a 55g planted Amazon tank, one canister filter is sufficient.

You might want to check the photos of my Amazonian setups; my 115g Amazon Riverscape and 90g flooded Amazon forest in particular. These illustrate what I mean by forest fish, plants, minimal filtration, low light. There is the series "A Basic Approach to the Natural Planted Aquarium" at the top of the Aquarium Plants section you should read through for background, as all that applies to the fish and plants you want.

For fish mixes, have a look at the species in our Tropical Fish Profiles, second tab from the left in the blue bar at the top; or click on shaded names in posts to see that fish/plant profile.

This is for starters.

Byron.
Thanks Ill try keeping currents down. But I like the fluvals. Since they keep cleaning to a minimum.

I really like angel fish. In any case my dad just bought 2 55gs. and 2 40gs. So with that we have like 4 extra tanks. Iam thinking Id get him to puit a pair of angels in one. In any case Id love to keep em though. As there is nothing more beautiful than an angelfish. I will look at the charts.
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Old 09-12-2010, 11:10 PM   #6
 
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I cannot find the compability chart. But I have doing some research apparently these would do well:
Striped raphael catfish
Sterbai catfish
Leopard Catfish
Gambusia(mosquitofish)
Blackskirt tetras


Idk about angel fish though.
Id love angels.

Also I remember reading that stuff like guppies, and danios would do great. My water temps would stay at a minimum of 72degrees. Id rather it keep to like say.... 75? or so? I also want to keep my air pumps(air bubble maker-lol)
As for plants I like. I checked the log and I looked up these plants that I like:
-Frogbit
-Amazon Swords
-Ruffled Amazon swords
-Java Moss
-Baby's tears(favorite plant)
-Anachris(second favorite Idk how to deal with it though)
-Brazilian penny wort
-Anubias
-Wisteria
-Corkscrew Vallisneria


If I need a C02 diffussion just tell me cause I can easilly buy one. I remember it saying to feed t he plants liquid foods. Soooo... iam going to buy 2-3bottles of em just in case. Could you give me instructions of how often to feed em? Currently the tank is a 55g but Iam waiting to get a 75g.

As for fish Id really like to keep:
-2 raphael catfish

-5sterbai corydoras
-5leopard corydoras
-12 to 13 of the following(just one of these species. I just want a school of fish)
Mosquito fish
Zebra Danios
Blackskirt tetras
Neon tetras
Guppies(black colored ones. I dont like the fancy ones for some reason, except the blue deltas).


Id love to have a pair of angels as well but that may not be possible so Id rather have a large school of fish that hang out in the middle of the tank for the majority swimming closely together(think of saltwater mackerel fish).
Then a small school of bottom feeders.
3-5snails.

thatd be it. Well of course two hatchling SOUTHERN sternotherus odoratus(southerns max out at 3.5inches). Tis why I wanted to use two filters, to make sure water quality is kept clean. I guess Id take out the hang on back filter though. Id put sponges in the filter(the part where the water goes out) so it doesnt make a strong current. Id get rid of mainly all the ornaments I was going to use in that tank and only use one large rock and some drift wood. I also know where to get a good plant light. So id get two lights, one uv light and one plant light. Though I may just go for the uv on a basking area which will be on top of the tank so it doesnt bother the fish. You know?



As for the last comment. I made this loose so I put it in a General discussion so I was able to get help. Thats why.

Iam just slightly afraid of aplanted tank because they look not only delicate but hard to keep. I also dont know how to read ph and the other thing. Well I think I know how to read ph but Idk how to read that acid or alkaline thing. Also in this tank would it be bad if I used 2-4scoops of salts and minerals made for cichlids. I like the tank water to have some salt for health of the fish and inhabitants.

I just want to be helped abit.
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Old 09-13-2010, 05:06 AM   #7
 
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I can promise you that planted tanks are neither inherently delicate nor hard to keep. But you need to slow up! So much info in one post.

The profiles are the second link from the left on the blue bar up top.

I suspect that the Raphael is going to be too large for this tank eventually which will lead to aggression and bioload issues. Also, all the livebearers you mentioned require hard, basic water. Essentially the opposite of the requirements of the angels. Not gonna work in the long run. Do your research.

Also, you can definitely do a planted tank without any Co2. Just choose low light plants and the appropriate lighting. Wish I could "easily buy" something as expensive as a Co2 system. Geez.
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Old 09-13-2010, 11:29 AM   #8
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burnsbabe View Post
I can promise you that planted tanks are neither inherently delicate nor hard to keep. But you need to slow up! So much info in one post.

The profiles are the second link from the left on the blue bar up top.

I suspect that the Raphael is going to be too large for this tank eventually which will lead to aggression and bioload issues. Also, all the livebearers you mentioned require hard, basic water. Essentially the opposite of the requirements of the angels. Not gonna work in the long run. Do your research.

Also, you can definitely do a planted tank without any Co2. Just choose low light plants and the appropriate lighting. Wish I could "easily buy" something as expensive as a Co2 system. Geez.
Where I live they only cost 20bucks??? Thats pretty cheap in my opinion. I saw it on petco.

Sorry theres alot of information in one post, but when I go to other forums people get mad because I post my stuff in several different posts. So its really confussing going back and forth.

Honestly I dont care for the angels, my dad can just get a pair and put em in a 55g of his own. All Iam really looking for my tank is:
-Large school of fish that like to school together and constantly move left to right, ussually hanging out in the middlle of the tank.
-Medium sized school of cories(12cats)
-2 larger fish that are peaceful and graceful. I also like gouramis but I thought or think they may be aggressive.

I also like loaches. Favorite loach being the weather loach. In any case this tank would be inhabitated by one or two turtles(musk/mud or male texas map which stay at 3.5).

Iam just waiting to get a 75g first before I start anything besides the baby turtles.
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Old 09-13-2010, 11:31 AM   #9
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burnsbabe View Post
I can promise you that planted tanks are neither inherently delicate nor hard to keep. But you need to slow up! So much info in one post.
Agree w/ burns on both counts. Planted tanks are easy and yes, way too much info in one post. Makes it difficult to keep up. Also, have a read of Byron's four part stickys in the planted section. Pretty much all the info you need to know about keeping and maintaining a planted tank is in those stickys.
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Old 09-13-2010, 01:24 PM   #10
 
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In this response post, I am only going to deal with one issue--community fish. You cannot put any mix of fish in the same tank. All the fish in a given aquarium must, and I repeat, must have the same requirements with respect to

(1) water parameters (pH, hardness, temperature). Some fish adapt somewhat, others cannot. First know what comes out of your tap, then decide if you will have fish that can manage in that water, or if you intend adjusting the hardness/pH by natural means, not chemicals which will not work.

(2) water movement, determined by the filter. There are slow-water fish that will literally burn out having to battle against a constant current, and there are fish that need such a current or they will suffocate. You generally cannot mix the two because you can't create two different environments, although a slight overlap will work with the right filter and tank setup and certain fish.

(3) environment, by which I mean the aquascaping. There are fish that absolutely must have wood, or rock caves, or specific substrate, or plants, or floating plants; this must be considered when selecting possible fish.

(4) lighting: there are fish that will not be "comfortable" under lights, so minimal lighting is chosen, plus floating plants help in this. If plants are in the tank, the lighting has to be sufficient while still keeping in mind the fish's needs. Some plants do better than others under different lighting.

(5) behavioural compatibility; sedate fish do not last long with active fish that constantly disturb them. Some fish will nip fins and can't be kept with slow sedate long-fin fish like angels. Some catfish will harass other fish particularly bottom fish to death. All of this has to be considered.

The information in our fish profiles addresses all these issues.

The first thing is to know the water parameters; then decide on fish accordingly.
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