20 Gallon Tank given - Page 3 - Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources
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post #21 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 03:53 PM Thread Starter
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I did read that the tetra can be a little aggressive, especially at feeding time. But what I have read is that they are more aggressive toward each other than other fish (unless the fish have long fins like guppy or betta). I will keep an eye on this and see how things go, but they have been with the rasbora for a while and seem to be fine.
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post #22 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 04:02 PM
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The Serpae aggression is toward each other if there are enough of them. I had five in a tank and took them back just last week. They've been in the tank for a long time (office tank, I had nothing to do with it until recently) and they all but ate a cory that was in there.

Given the choice, I would return the serpae and keep the rasbora and add to their numbers. 20 gallons is not a lot of space.

I have a betta so I did a lot of researching into what fish work well together and went with very community type of fish (other than the betta obviously, it pre-existed the first tank though) in my first tank and I am doing the same thing in my second. The main reason is that I feel there is enough in keeping fish in healthy environments that I don't need to add possible aggression and stress that arises out of even slightly mis-matched fish.

At least some things should be easy.

Jeff.
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Total years fish keeping experience: 7 months, can't start counting in years for a while yet.

The shotgun approach to a planted tank with an LED fixture

Small scale nitrogen cycle with a jar, water and fish food; no substrate, filter etc
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post #23 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 04:11 PM Thread Starter
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Fair enough. Are there any other tetra that would be similar to the serpae (size and overall shape) that would fair well without the aggression? I really like the look of the serpae tetra and wanted to get more, but if it will cause problems with my ram (which is the fish that I want to base my tank off of) then I would get rid of them.

I mainly got the tetra and rasbora because my fish store told me that they would be good to add during the cycle because they would be hardy enough to withstand the water.
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post #24 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 05:05 PM
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Fair enough. Are there any other tetra that would be similar to the serpae (size and overall shape) that would fair well without the aggression? I really like the look of the serpae tetra and wanted to get more, but if it will cause problems with my ram (which is the fish that I want to base my tank off of) then I would get rid of them.

I mainly got the tetra and rasbora because my fish store told me that they would be good to add during the cycle because they would be hardy enough to withstand the water.
It is unfortunate that the Serpae is so pretty, and so readily available, because it is not really a good community fish except when it can be provided the numbers (at least 8 in the group, or more is better) and the space (a 30g tank for a group of this species could be a stunning display). In larger tanks it can live reasonably peacefully (in a large group) with other fish, except never long-finned or sedate species. Check the profile.

The rasbora needs more, but it is a lovely and peaceful fish. With this species, I wold have no less than 7, so to your 3 add another 4 or 5.

There are many other compatible species, have a look through the tetra in the characids profile area
Characid Species. They are listed in alpha order by scientific name, but if you hover the cursor over each the common name shows up. But that won't mean much either, so click the post to see the photos at the bottom, and the data above. Minimum numbers, minimum tank size, compatibility are all included for each.

You might want to look at the Red Phantom, Rosy, Flame or Robert's Tetra, for some red, or the Lemon for yellow (nice contrast with the ram and rasbora). Just check temps, I can't remember off the top of my head, and as Jeff mentioned earlier, the ram needs higher temps than some of these will appreciate.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #25 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 07:37 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks, Byron. My thing with the serpae tetra is that they have an almost orange look to them. I actually have the neon serpae tetra (at least thats what they were listed as at the store). They have an almost orange look to them, and orange happens to by my favorite color. My rasbora do have a very beautiful orange on them. As much as I would hate to say it (because I love my tetra) I may have to step away from tetra altogether because I just can't find any that really stand out to me like the serpae. I'm going to look for some other fish that go well with my blue ram and go from there. thank you and JDM for everything!
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post #26 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 07:52 PM
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Thanks, Byron. My thing with the serpae tetra is that they have an almost orange look to them. I actually have the neon serpae tetra (at least thats what they were listed as at the store). They have an almost orange look to them, and orange happens to by my favorite color. My rasbora do have a very beautiful orange on them. As much as I would hate to say it (because I love my tetra) I may have to step away from tetra altogether because I just can't find any that really stand out to me like the serpae. I'm going to look for some other fish that go well with my blue ram and go from there. thank you and JDM for everything!
One option, and probably a good one as this is only a 20g tank, is to increase the rasbora to 12, along with the pair of rams, and then perhaps add some substrate fish, keeping in mind the temperature (some won't survive).

Just keep in mind that substrate fish will mean no survivng fry from the rams, if that matters; cichlids will spawn when settled, regularly, and will do their best to protect the eggs and fry, but all substrate fish (corys, pleco, etc) are nocturnal and this is when they easily get the eggs or fry. So if raising some of them is desired, leave out substrate fish.

Byron.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #27 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 09:07 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you, I think that would give me some activity in the tank that I would like. As far as raising the rams, its not a priority of mine, because my water is medium hard and not the soft that people say that blue rams spawn in. If they could spawn, I would not mind that, but I am limited on space and if I were to have babies, then I wouldn't have room for them.

As for substrate fish, I really want to stay away from cory. I have cory in my two other tanks (I have three total) and I would rather find something different to add to this tank. Earlier you mentioned the whiptail catfish, would this go well with the rams or no? If not, I will have to look at what my fish stores have in terms of bottom fish. (Also, keep in mind that I do have a decent number of snails patrolling my tank)
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post #28 of 36 Old 05-30-2013, 09:48 PM
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I was going to suggest the silvertip tetra but you wanted and orange colour, they are more gold/yellow but are Ok up to 82F. Not my choice to only have a 2 degree temperature range overlap though. You really should have the temp ranges match up closely as it is easier to manage with some variations and easier on the fish long term.

Jeff


Total years fish keeping experience: 7 months, can't start counting in years for a while yet.

The shotgun approach to a planted tank with an LED fixture

Small scale nitrogen cycle with a jar, water and fish food; no substrate, filter etc
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post #29 of 36 Old 05-31-2013, 09:39 AM
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Thank you, I think that would give me some activity in the tank that I would like. As far as raising the rams, its not a priority of mine, because my water is medium hard and not the soft that people say that blue rams spawn in. If they could spawn, I would not mind that, but I am limited on space and if I were to have babies, then I wouldn't have room for them.

As for substrate fish, I really want to stay away from cory. I have cory in my two other tanks (I have three total) and I would rather find something different to add to this tank. Earlier you mentioned the whiptail catfish, would this go well with the rams or no? If not, I will have to look at what my fish stores have in terms of bottom fish. (Also, keep in mind that I do have a decent number of snails patrolling my tank)
Watch the temperature; Whiptails are not warm water fish, so not a good match.

Byron Hosking, BMus, MA
Vancouver, BC, Canada

The aquarist is one who must learn the ways of the biologist, the chemist, and the veterinarian. [unknown source]

Something we all need to remember: The fish you've acquired was quite happy not being owned by you, minding its own business. If you’re going to take it under your wing then you’re responsible for it. Every aspect of its life is under your control, from water quality and temperature to swimming space. [Nathan Hill in PFK]
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post #30 of 36 Old 05-31-2013, 09:44 AM
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The regular whiptail is listed as 68-77F whereas the red lizard is 71-82F... which, besides the colour, was one of the many reasons I chose the reds for my second tank.... still not as warm watered as the rams, which I think are 80-86F.

Jeff.


Total years fish keeping experience: 7 months, can't start counting in years for a while yet.

The shotgun approach to a planted tank with an LED fixture

Small scale nitrogen cycle with a jar, water and fish food; no substrate, filter etc
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