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Planted tank with Bean Animal style overflow

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Planted tank with Bean Animal style overflow
Old 05-12-2014, 07:34 AM   #11
 
Sump capacity will be 1200 to 1500 liters with industrial type fan for cooling.

Water level will be maintained using a dual float electrical switch as used in local storage tanks to start a small well pump.

Initial filtration will be:

Filter sock x 2 (cant see how to get three pipes into one so the emergency will have its own which may never be used so)
Small ceramic rings or something plastic like Eheim Mech under the socks to catch what the
Coarse foam block as used in pond filters so available here
Floss (a lot of it in a separate compartment)
BioGro or BioHome Ultimate (claimed good for nitrates as well)

The largest penultimate chamber will have:
Surface plants (maybe)
Lava rock for nitrates
Algae turf scrubber with 66onm LED lighting

The outputs from the pair of pumps in the final chamber will have a tee valved with a hose barb so that water change disposals can be used on the garden.

My wife will take care of feeding duties and monitor the aquarium. She likes the fish and plants but not the noise of fans etc. Because she is not overly technical the power for the lights will be set up redundantly and there will be a couple of emergency 10 watt eBay LED panels ready for use in case of driver or LED failure. I'm using just two of these on a CO2 injected 55 gallon and they are dimmed to about 60 percent because of algae growth if they are run flat out.

My LFS guy will also be on call for anything she can't handle but he is more into aquascaping than the technical side of things. He can improvise if necessary and a single point failure on lights or a single pump failure will not be catastrophic. The overflow (if it works as I hope) is fail safe and will provide ample audible warning should there be a blockage in the full siphon because the siphon in the open channel should make and break causing plenty of gurgling.
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Old 05-12-2014, 07:56 AM   #12
 
Your husband makes sense for twin Dursos but he hasn't studied the Bean Animal overflow system.

The full siphon channel has a gate valve to adjust the flow rate. It should be adjusted so that the water level gives some flow to the open channel. After stopping and then restarting the pumps the full siphon channel will self establish once the air bubbles clear the pipe (usually 1 to 2 minutes) and the level will come back to that set by the gate valve. The beauty of the system is that you get a variable siphon flow rate allowing the level to be set so that the open channel is silent as well. Power loss will do the same thing when the power comes back on.

A blockage in the full siphon means that the water level will rise so that the air bleed line in the open channel eventually gets blocked by water and it will try to be a full siphon. The large pipe size means this won't be possible except for very short periods with the water level rising and falling as your husband described and the noise will alert us to a problem.

The emergency standpipe makes sure that there is even more redundancy. If the open channel for any reason can't keep up with the flow rate then it will pick up the slack. I'm thinking about raising the emergency as having it too low may interfere with the open channel establishing a full siphon. You could use a gate valve on the open channel as well and if the full siphon was completely blocked it would work as before, silently but with a higher water level, but the variables in possible blockage size in the full siphon makes this unreliable and we want to know if there is a problem in any case.

The design is very elegant and works superbly in full length overflows, internal or external on conventional tanks being largely self tuning and recovering from power outages or deliberate shut downs by itself. If there is a slow build-up of slime in the pipe of the full siphon it needs to block the gate valve orifice to make a difference in water levels. Once this happens the water levels rise and the open channel starts working as a full siphon part of the time (due to dropping water levels) and the noise alerts us.

I just stumbled onto it by looking for overflow silencers when I started planning the tank. Bean Animal deserves any credit for mind work, I'm just trying to adapt his system for a strange application.
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:02 AM   #13
 
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Amazing....this tank should be a reef...really. Especially considering you are surrounded by amazing fish and corals!
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:06 AM   #14
 
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The filtration sounds good. I have recently stopped using the bags of ceramic rings in my sump due to nutrient build up. I have gone with a simpler solution of two large custom cut pieces of Poret foam{made in Germany} I also use a large filter sock at the inlet to the sump, swapping it out with one I keep in a bucket with bleach to clean weekly. The filter sock is great for catching larger debris, and keep that from blocking the foam.
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Old 05-13-2014, 03:29 AM   #15
 
I love reef tanks but there are a few issues with this. The first is the maintenance involved. With the work I do I am away for extended periods so that puts reefing out of contention.

The second issue is that the way people here collect specimens is a long way from sustainable use. MY LFS guy provides Sulawesi shrimp and indigenous water plants to several channels but he makes sure that the way that these are collected is sustainable. It's not so much a moral issue for him so much as financial. He's a young guy and wants his business to be long term. That said he has stopped some lines because he found that the people collecting the specimens were doing so irresponsibly.

The final issue is the equipment availability. Reef equipment needs to be reliable and what is locally available can be less than ideal in that respect.
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Old 05-13-2014, 04:11 AM   #16
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keepsmiling View Post
The filtration sounds good. I have recently stopped using the bags of ceramic rings in my sump due to nutrient build up. I have gone with a simpler solution of two large custom cut pieces of Poret foam{made in Germany} I also use a large filter sock at the inlet to the sump, swapping it out with one I keep in a bucket with bleach to clean weekly. The filter sock is great for catching larger debris, and keep that from blocking the foam.
Interesting that the rings would cause problems moreso than the foam. Or was the issue that the rings were used as biomedia? I have found that many of the locally available ceramic rings have poor porosity after soak testing with precise weighing before and after. I will be using them mainly as mechanical filters to catch the bits that bypass the socks. I'm also planning on using the foam (probably not Poret as the locally available stuff looks and feels okay) and the biomedia will be expansive. Hopefully the algae scrubber and some floating plants along with the lava rock will keep nitrates under control.
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Old 05-13-2014, 05:36 AM   #17
 
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Well I have to thank you for taking my husband and I away from more stressful thoughts for an evening. We had fun discussing your plans, and mulling over it's potential for success, or not....
My husband wonders if the central part, the smoked glass you said will be used for it, will be slotted or flat? We seem to agree that whether this works or not depends on that area and it's capacity, vs the amount of water being pushed through. I printed the bean animal page and the graphic pics of the design for him to read while we visited when he came home from work. He thinks the bean animal design works/stays quiet because of the water being choked down so it hugs the walls of the one standpipe. And he mentioned the fact that it also utilizes the Anthony Calfo style wide overflow. We agreed we wouldn't use any type of strainer that could potentially get clogged. Any fish or debris would just go into the sump, or the filter sock. We have had many a fish go over the overflow into the sock.
Once we had a 65 gal tank with a small puffer and some of those huge black and white snails from Belize. One of those decided he needed to clean off a pipe and so for a while he was totally blocking the pipe. I remember standing there freaking out on what I should do, as the water sheared over all 4 sides of the tank. Hubby handles emergencies way better than I do, but he wasn't home at the time....
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Old 05-13-2014, 06:43 AM   #18
 
The flood problem is one of the main reasons I am looking at the Bean Animal overflow. The thought of 1200 liters of water going inside the house while we are sleeping upstairs is not a pretty one. I'm glad your husband got away from thinking about the stresses of everyday life for a bit as well.

His ideas on the overflow are almost right but he is still thinking more along the line of Dursos. I also had problems getting my head around the principles as a restricted pipe running full siphon didn't make much sense. Then I thought about the times when I have had a snail in an outlet hose and realized that it didn't break the siphon, simply reduced the flow.

The full siphon is completely full of water all the time when things are working normally. That, along with a minimal flow in the Durso open channel, is what eliminates the noise. The beauty of the system is the added air hose on the open channel allowing for it to become a full siphon if the water level rises. Simple adjustments to the valve on the open channel set the water height in the overflow and then we just need to set the height of the air bleed on the open channel accordingly.

I originally thought about a toothed overflow but fish still seem to get over them and snails go anywhere they want anyway. Smooth weirs create less noise, especially with full radius on top. I have thought about going to a smooth slot but having them laser cut is pretty costly in Singapore, the nearest place I can get that sort of work done. I'm still considering making a box, complete with a thin base, out of acrylic and using the bulkheads to tie things together and then the slots could be easily cut here.

Another thing I am waiting on is information about the DC pumps now available. With electronic controllers they can be set to a lower flow and this might be good for redundancy as I could use two larger pumps at reduced flow rates and in the event of one failing the other could be opened up to pick up the slack. My only concern is that in the event of a power outage they may not turn back on at the previous setting with the electronic controllers.

The other way to go is use two large standard pumps with ball valves controlling the flow but then we get more heat output and use more electricity all the time. I may simply have to set things up so that one pump runs and have valves set for a spare one installed alongside to take its place in the event of a problem.

This is going to be a slow process due to ordering parts in from outside. Customs here can take ages.

If you want to see a good build for an Indonesian reef tank here (mostly in Indonesian but lots of pictures) take a look at My Dream Tank : 255 x 120 x 90 StarphireŽ Ultra Clear Glass | Indonesia's Saltwater Aquarium Hobbyist Community

The guy who did this really went all out with a large bank of batteries and inverter to take over during even extended power outages. Looking at the gear he bought was another reason I'm sticking with a planted tank. Local substrates are fine and once the glass, pumps, a few fittings like bulkheads and such, heatsinks, power supplies and LEDs get here the rest is just job work. That is until I decide to set up light controller but my wife has yet to approve that. Once she sees how much I spend on the rest she may never do so.
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Old 05-13-2014, 07:05 AM   #19
 
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Buy her something equally as nice and maybe she will be more understanding...
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Old 05-13-2014, 08:23 AM   #20
 
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Well..hubby had a lot to say before he left for work on your idea of using DC pumps.He majored in electronics btw, and our business is repair and maintenance of large/ industrial trucks, trailers, pumps, A/C, engines, transmissions, lighting, etc...and we do it mobile from the back of an International straight truck. It's basically a full shop on wheels.
We do deal with DC pumps. He said they are not as efficient, are costly, and need rebuilding quite often. They are not made to run 24/7. We recently had to purchase brushes for a good Leeson motor, and they were $200.00 and to rebuild it was $500.00. The pump itself cost $1200.00.{wholesale} He said on average he gets them rebuilt every year or two, and they are only running several hours a day.
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