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Overstocking by Experienced Aquarists

This is a discussion on Overstocking by Experienced Aquarists within the Advanced Freshwater Discussion forums, part of the Freshwater Fish and Aquariums category; --> [quote=jaysee;4036817]Jpepe by that rationale we shouldn't be keeping fish, because there is no tank size that compares to the wild. It's up to each ...

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Overstocking by Experienced Aquarists
Old 03-03-2014, 05:04 PM   #21
 
[quote=jaysee;4036817]Jpepe by that rationale we shouldn't be keeping fish, because there is no tank size that compares to the wild.

It's up to each of us to decide for ourselves how we want to stock and how much space our fish need to swim - it's very much an individual hobby.[/quote None of my fish ever lived in the wild.Most of my fish are strains that don't live anywhere but in aquariums.My views are what works for me, that doesn't mean that you need to share them.I'm not judging anybody I was just sharing a different opinion.
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Old 03-03-2014, 06:30 PM   #22
 
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You are very right jpepe. To each their own. I don't recall you berating other aquarists for their stocking methods ( if you have I retract my lack of judgement )
I actually do have fish very close to wilds. Many many f1s .. Only ones I have in moderately stocked tanks are my Pygmy sunfish and ornate bichir( well my bichirs dry 240 that hasn't been moved yet ) . My others do quite well in my overstocked tank. It's all about what my individual fishes needs are . I know I've chosen African cichlids that are well suited and personality matched perfectly to be in an overstocked tank .. The over filtration and high circulation help keep them happy . My ornate on the other hand I have to stock carefully around.. He prefers to choose his tank mates .. That's what he needs . Each type of fish is different. Actually after talking about this I do wonder if I can find a way to duplicate how I make these judgments ..


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Old 03-04-2014, 10:32 AM   #23
 
there are so many different variables with overstocking concerns.
i think overstocking is absolutely fine if done with respects to the fish and maintenance.
a few times i have overstocked...
1) my kenyi and auratus started madly breeding and instead of separating them, i kept the juvies in a 55 gallon to the point where i could not see the back of the tank.(maybe ill find one of the pics)
i kept them all to near adult size in that tank, no runts or stunted growth... it was a real chore cleaning it multiple times per week, but they were happy and healthy.
and cichlids are known to be densely packed in real life...
2) another example, my 125 had misc malawi cichlids loaches, 20 inch fire eel, and a full grown midas cichlid. not heavily stocked by numbers, but the eel and midas took up alot of the air. luckily i noticed and added more current and multiple air lines. after adding air, everyone was fine.
the tank was not crowded but the size of the fish can make a difference.
i think overstocking looks so cool with the right fish and layout.
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:43 PM   #24
 
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i would have to agree that fish seem to behave more naturally and generally enjoy life more in lightly stocked tanks. Thats only my experience and i withhold all judgement for anyone who sees otherwise or prefers the look of a heavily stocked tank. Thats the great thing about this hobby, theres room for all kinds of people. I like a natural looking tank with natural substrate and nothing artificial. Others may like Ornaments or unnatural decorations, some people love the G lo-fish thing. Fortunate thing is that no one has to be right and no one has to be wrong. I find it distasteful that someone would keep fish in less than great conditions, but that's only my opinion. There are bait shops that keep live fish with the exclusive goal of them one day being killed. Are they immoral or wrong for conducting their business ?
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:50 PM   #25
 
happy fish

what constitutes a 'happy fish' ???

i see lots of people saying their fish are happy in their tank, ... their tank could be pristine, or dirty, ... and they're promoting that their fish are 'happy' ???

what makes a fish happy ?

i know i'm happy with a full belly :), and plenty of rest :) :)

but what about for a fish ?

(there's gotta be some better threads on here promoting some smiles and joy over the ones of people arguing - yes i'm guilty of that too)

what about guilty pleasures ?, do fish have those ???

Edit:
this was supposed to be a new thread, sorry all

Last edited by Flear; 03-04-2014 at 03:59 PM..
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Old 03-04-2014, 04:09 PM   #26
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flear View Post
what constitutes a 'happy fish' ???

i see lots of people saying their fish are happy in their tank, ... their tank could be pristine, or dirty, ... and they're promoting that their fish are 'happy' ???

what makes a fish happy ?

i know i'm happy with a full belly :), and plenty of rest :) :)

but what about for a fish ?

(there's gotta be some better threads on here promoting some smiles and joy over the ones of people arguing - yes i'm guilty of that too)

what about guilty pleasures ?, do fish have those ???

Edit:
this was supposed to be a new thread, sorry all
lol I think that's another opinion thing on the keepers part, mostly. In my opinion, if my fish are happy, aren't sick, and have space for their species, and numbers for their species preference, they're happy.
It's also my opinion that, if you have too many fish in a smaller over-stocked tank where they don't have the space to swim, they get stressed, bored and unhappy because they can't do as they were meant to do: Swim.

Guilty pleasures? Hmm, I don't think so, but I consider eating ones young a guilty pleasure...however it's normal to the fish! Some anyways. lol

Eating? Well, if the fish isn't feeling the burn of hunger and starvation, I don't know if it makes them HAPPY so much as not feel cruddy and hungry.

Fish don't think the way people do. I think they're "Happy" if they have their needs all taken care of and can just be fish and swim as they should.

I also agree a lot of well cared for, but over-stocked tanks look pretty. Some fish seem fine with it too, but other times you got stress going on, and if they're stressed they're not happy. If they're stunting, they're hurting, or just can't figure out why they're not working properly and not happy.

Basically it's all opinions on it though, and those are mine: Enough room to be fish and properly grow and swim, enough group members to feel secure, properly fed and cleaned up after with stuff to do in the tank like investigate plants and caves and the like = happy fish.
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Old 03-04-2014, 04:44 PM   #27
 
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I believe my fish are happy when they are in full color, active and eating.

For those of you that are interested, I am about to start my 10 gallon back up and will be documenting the process as it goes. I feel that this will show those interested in advancing in the hobby how exactly one would go about over-stocking safely, the parameters to expect, ect.

The Overstock Project
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Old 03-04-2014, 06:29 PM   #28
 
Is overstocking safely a good thing? I totally get the mbuma thing,it makes sense. Are you going to keep 50 small fish in a 10 gallon,maybe 100, maybe 200? Should we be impressed? By the very word, OVERstocking means too many fish in a finite space.There is no doubt it can be done,but should it be done ? I want to meet the guy (or gal) who can raise generations of tetras ,that's an aquarist.
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Old 03-04-2014, 06:52 PM   #29
 
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I'm not talking about putting hundreds of fish in a 10 gallon. I never once said that. Overstocking, more often than not, doesn't have anything to do with space but more likely water quality. If you can keep your water quality pristine, you can overstock to an extent. I'm not saying that means put an Oscar in a 10 gallon and do daily water changes, there is a space issue there, but keeping a gourami, a shoal of small tetras, maybe two, a BN and a shoal of small cories doesn't present a huge space issue (unless you are one to argue the tetra thing) it will just mean more upkeep.

ETA - Just because you don't breed tetras, doesn't make you an inexperienced or bad aquarist.
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Old 03-04-2014, 07:29 PM   #30
 
There is a difference between heavy stocking by an experienced individual and actual 'overstocking'. I don't consider any of my tanks over stocked, tho some certainly might. The point here is that heavy stocking does not have any negative impacts on most fish provided it is done correctly.

I've bred some tetra species accidentally in heavily stocked tanks and had a few lucky fry survive, I don't really think there is anything special about that. As usually egg scatterers collection and fry survival is pretty piss poor unless setup for specific breeding of tetras, getting many of them to spawn isn't hard at all. All together my 6 GBR do about a spawn a week, occasionally 2. My breeding group of boesemani rainbows spawn more days then not and have a mop in their tank for that reason.

Over stocking is an misused word IMO. You are only overstocked if the tank is not maintainable at the current conditions. If it is maintainable then its not over stocked.

If you want guilty pleasures feed live black worms.

Tank footprint plays a huge effect when heavy stocking. Thats the reason 'breeder' tanks exist. 8 rams in a 40 gallon may sound like a lot but then you have to factor that tank has a 36"x18" footprint or 648 square inches. In comparison a standard 55 at 48"x12" has a smaller footprint at 576 square inches. This plus how I maintain my tanks is how I would say my 40B still has room for fish.
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